Michelin Pilot Road 3 ( Revised )

[CIP57_imp]

Ready to pull the trigger on a pair of these. With the 4.25 rear rim these tires are within the guidelines for fitment. The rear is a 160/60-18 this may throw off the speedo a bit, how much I'm not sure. The wider tire and profile may also slow up turn in as well ( although these tires are more rounded than stock) I think I'm going to give them a try. Always had great success with my Pilot Power 2CT's. I could always drop the front a 1/4 or 1/2 inch if the steering is heavy.

Edit: Link
http://motorcycle.michelinman.com/tires/michelin-pilot-road-3#dim

 

[Ack-CB11_imp]

I put a set on a BMW R1200RT, loved them. You will too.
I'd consider them a few steps up in performance from my stock 205's.

 

[Ridem32_imp]

CIP I been thinking about the speedo. I might be wrong but here goes : the speedo reads off of the abs sensor. So a smaller or larger tire should not matter when we put our bikes on center stand and ran them to 120 mph to check rpm in 4th 5th and 6th gear even if we did not have a tire on the rim at all the speedo would still be the same! I might be wrong but would a bigger or smaller tire change the speed of bike even thou it's reading correctly at the abs sensor wheel?

 

[rboe]

If you have a larger diameter tire the wheel will spin slower at any given speed than the smaller tire. Too take this to extremes, imagine your little 13" trailer tire spinning like crazy at 75mph while your jacked up Ford pickup with monster tires fairly pokes around at 75mph (but humming like crazy, but that is another problem).

Same speed, different rpm's.

The ABS sensor only see's the rpm's. In the software that converts that rpm to mph a few things are assumed to be constant like the tire diameter and the speed will be incorrect if the assumed figure does not match reality.

 

[Ridem32_imp]

The new cars & trucks run the speedo off of the Trans speed sensor so if you change tires it does throw the speedo off. Older bikes that used cables on the front wheel if you changed to a smaller tire it would make the gear spin faster throwing the speedo off. But reading off of the wheel it self I don't see where it would throw off the speedo no matter what size tire you run. But again I might be wrong!

 

[CIP57_imp]

CIP I been thinking about the speedo. I might be wrong but here goes : the speedo reads off of the abs sensor. So a smaller or larger tire should not matter when we put our bikes on center stand and ran them to 120 mph to check rpm in 4th 5th and 6th gear even if we did not have a tire on the rim at all the speedo would still be the same! I might be wrong but would a bigger or smaller tire change the speed of bike even thou it's reading correctly at the abs sensor wheel?

Here's the data, tire are almost the same in diameter, which means no need to alter front end and speedo is is off .5 at 60mph almost no change. Gives you a better performance tire with a little more meat.

140/70-R18 vs 160/60-R18 Tire Comparison - Tire Size Calculator | Tacoma World

[url=http://www.tacomaworld.com/forum/tirecalc.php?tires=140-70r18-160-60r18]

 

[Ridem32_imp]

Good info.

 

[Randy B]

The new cars & trucks run the speedo off of the Trans speed sensor so if you change tires it does throw the speedo off. Older bikes that used cables on the front wheel if you changed to a smaller tire it would make the gear spin faster throwing the speedo off. But reading off of the wheel it self I don't see where it would throw off the speedo no matter what size tire you run. But again I might be wrong!

Never think about the rim diameter, but rather the diameter of the tire, or more importantly the revolutions per mile. You can have 2 tires that are "the same size" but list different revolutions per mile. Those little differences add up and don't only add up to speedometer error, but to odometer error as well.

 

[Ridem32_imp]

I think on my abs mode the speed sensor reads off of the ring mounted on the wheel so no matter the size of the tire the speed and odometer should not change! I larger tire would have to turn more then a smaller tire would but the speed should read the same due to the reading coming from the ring on the rim. That's just what's stuck in my head. Heck I could be wrong but just can't see how a bigger tire would change speedo reading when the sensor and ring still the same size

 

[Barkingshins_imp]

I think on my abs mode the speed sensor reads off of the ring mounted on the wheel so no matter the size of the tire the speed and odometer should not change! I larger tire would have to turn more then a smaller tire would but the speed should read the same due to the reading coming from the ring on the rim. That's just what's stuck in my head. Heck I could be wrong but just can't see how a bigger tire would change speedo reading when the sensor and ring still the same size

Changing the size of your tires certainly does throw the accuracy of the speedo and odometer off. The ABS sensor only gives the software one piece of the equation... RPMs. Doing the math for distance and speed (which is just distance/time) requires knowing the geometry of the wheel itself since a larger wheel travels further with each rotation than a smaller one does. Changing the geometry of the wheel without changing the equations the software uses will produce an inaccurate result. The more dramatic the change, the more inaccurate the result.

Since we are talking about relatively minor changes to wheel diameter here, I'm sure that the speedo inaccuracies would be fairly negligible (+/- a fraction of 1 mph). However, the odometer reading would become increasingly inaccurate as your bike ages and, assuming your bike has a good long life, could eventually be thousands of miles off.

 

[JohnNevets_imp]

I'm sure I'm going to get crap for this, but here is the math.

If you take a tire put a mark on it and rolled it along the ground until you got back to the mark that would be the circumference of the tire. This is also Pie*Diameter or 3.14*D. The sensor is measuring revolutions of the wheel. It doesn't matter that the location it is measuring this is inside the outer diameter it is still just measuring the number of revolutions. If you put a mark on the ring the sensor was looking at it will always be in line with the mark you made on the tire. So if you took that number of revolutions multiplied by the circumference of the outside of the tire you would get the distance you have traveled. Remember the bike is doing all the math (Rev*3.14*D) now if you change the diameter significantly, but don't let the bike know it still does the same math. So even though you would travel a different distance, based solely on revolutions, it still thinks you went the old distance.

Example time.
So say you went from a stock 25" tire to a 30" tire. What the bike is reporting is 25*3.14*Rev*0.0000157828 (the last bit is just to get it from inches to miles). What is actually happening is the outside of the tire is traveling 30*3.14*Rev*0.0000157828. What this means is by the time you actually have traveled 1 mile you have made 672.6 revolutions of the wheel. Since the bike is still using the old formula it reports you have only traveled .83 miles.

This is true if it is measuring the revolutions of the wheel, or some part of the transmission. The only time it would not be true is on the old style bicycle style odometers that used a direct drive mechanism that made contact with the outside diameter of the tier, this would be accurate no matter what size tire you used.

And also like CIP pointed out, the difference in outer diameter with this particular tire is so small, it really doesn't matter at all.

I know that was way more educational in tone then this forum is used to (or probably wants), but I hope it helped.

 

[Greg_imp]

This forum has high tolerance for pedantic a••••••s. I should know.

 

[CIP57_imp]

I'm sure I'm going to get crap for this, but here is the math.

If you take a tire put a mark on it and rolled it along the ground until you got back to the mark that would be the circumference of the tire. This is also Pie*Diameter or 3.14*D. The sensor is measuring revolutions of the wheel. It doesn't matter that the location it is measuring this is inside the outer diameter it is still just measuring the number of revolutions. If you put a mark on the ring the sensor was looking at it will always be in line with the mark you made on the tire. So if you took that number of revolutions multiplied by the circumference of the outside of the tire you would get the distance you have traveled. Remember the bike is doing all the math (Rev*3.14*D) now if you change the diameter significantly, but don't let the bike know it still does the same math. So even though you would travel a different distance, based solely on revolutions, it still thinks you went the old distance.

Example time.
So say you went from a stock 25" tire to a 30" tire. What the bike is reporting is 25*3.14*Rev*0.0000157828 (the last bit is just to get it from inches to miles). What is actually happening is the outside of the tire is traveling 30*3.14*Rev*0.0000157828. What this means is by the time you actually have traveled 1 mile you have made 672.6 revolutions of the wheel. Since the bike is still using the old formula it reports you have only traveled .83 miles.

This is true if it is measuring the revolutions of the wheel, or some part of the transmission. The only time it would not be true is on the old style bicycle style odometers that used a direct drive mechanism that made contact with the outside diameter of the tier, this would be accurate no matter what size tire you used.

And also like CIP pointed out, the difference in outer diameter with this particular tire is so small, it really doesn't matter at all.

I know that was way more educational in tone then this forum is used to (or probably wants), but I hope it helped.

TY John for taking the time, but all this mention of PIE has made me hungry.

 

[Ridem32_imp]

I just ate lol. But that was a very good post john

 

[INTP_imp]

So, how are the tires?

 

[CIP57_imp]

So, how are the tires?

Just order them today, I'll have a report when i put them on. Still have a little life left in the OEM's.

 

[Red Mist_imp]

If you have a larger diameter tire the wheel will spin slower at any given speed than the smaller tire. Too take this to extremes, imagine your little 13" trailer tire spinning like crazy at 75mph while your jacked up Ford pickup with monster tires fairly pokes around at 75mph (but humming like crazy, but that is another problem).

Same speed, different rpm's.

The ABS sensor only see's the rpm's. In the software that converts that rpm to mph a few things are assumed to be constant like the tire diameter and the speed will be incorrect if the assumed figure does not match reality.

+1

Exact tire diameters can be obtained from the mfg. for comparison purposes. As my offering to the deities of pedanticism, the difference -- trivial as it may seem on paper -- can be greater in practice, as the tire expands in actual use. The difference is of course more noteworthy as speeds increase.

I'm sure I'm going to get crap for this, but here is the math.

If you take a tire put a mark on it and rolled it along the ground until you got back to the mark that would be the circumference of the tire. This is also Pie*Diameter or 3.14*D. The sensor is measuring revolutions of the wheel. It doesn't matter that the location it is measuring this is inside the outer diameter it is still just measuring the number of revolutions. If you put a mark on the ring the sensor was looking at it will always be in line with the mark you made on the tire. So if you took that number of revolutions multiplied by the circumference of the outside of the tire you would get the distance you have traveled. Remember the bike is doing all the math (Rev*3.14*D) now if you change the diameter significantly, but don't let the bike know it still does the same math. So even though you would travel a different distance, based solely on revolutions, it still thinks you went the old distance.

Example time.
So say you went from a stock 25" tire to a 30" tire. What the bike is reporting is 25*3.14*Rev*0.0000157828 (the last bit is just to get it from inches to miles). What is actually happening is the outside of the tire is traveling 30*3.14*Rev*0.0000157828. What this means is by the time you actually have traveled 1 mile you have made 672.6 revolutions of the wheel. Since the bike is still using the old formula it reports you have only traveled .83 miles.

This is true if it is measuring the revolutions of the wheel, or some part of the transmission. The only time it would not be true is on the old style bicycle style odometers that used a direct drive mechanism that made contact with the outside diameter of the tier, this would be accurate no matter what size tire you used.

And also like CIP pointed out, the difference in outer diameter with this particular tire is so small, it really doesn't matter at all.

I know that was way more educational in tone then this forum is used to (or probably wants), but I hope it helped.

Not really. Stick around, there be pedantry in abundance.

Provincial and parochial also apply aplenty. Sometimes all three. :rofl:

 

[Greg_imp]

Pendantic, provincial, parochial, oh my! :rofl:

:excited: cb1100

This is the one and only time I will EVER use emojis in a post

 

[Red Mist_imp]

Pendantic, provincial, parochial, oh my! :rofl:

:excited: cb1100

This is the one and only time I will EVER use emojis in a post

Forever flagellating the supine equine, that's us!

 

[flynrider]

So, how are the tires?

Just order them today, I'll have a report when i put them on. Still have a little life left in the OEM's.

I'm heading down the the local tire store on Fri. to see if I can get one of these to replace my front tire. It started showing wear bars about 400 miles ago. I'll follow up with the the rear tire when it starts showing some wear.

Ever since I started using Bridgestone BT-45s on the CB750, I've been sold on the dual compound concept. About 75% of my riding is mostly vertical freeway and city. If I get a softer compound that works in the twisties, it'll wear fast right down the middle of the tire. Harder compounds that last forever tend to sacrifice a lot of grip in hard cornering. Dual compound combines the best of both worlds.