Brake reservoir screw head issue

[j3gq_imp]

(dang) I remember doing this crap back in the early 80's and thought: Can't they engineer these reservoirs better?

Take the best of a chemical and mechanical engineer and make the issue go away? Maybe it has ... in outer space, but not in the civilian domain.

Heck, maybe not use "Phillips" screwheads might solve half the problem.

I have replaced all similar screws on my m/c with TORX screws (popularly called star bit screws). Problem gone forever. So may be you'll save the dollars for the engineers, and just do it

I have a "damaged screw remover set", cheap enough to buy and effective. Only used it once or twice but it did the job. You just need a reversing drill, preferably with speed control.

Is this set "noname" or some special brand ?

Well, I tried multiple options...
Removed the other screw and tried wiggling the cover - No movement.
Tried the rubber band - Gouged out more.
Tried hammering in a slotted screwdriver and twisting - It looked like the small screwdriver would break.

I took it to a local bike shop here (incidentally the same guys who last bled the brakes in 2018). The mechanic wasn't confident he could drill it without damaging the threads. The suggestion was to get a replacement reservoir just in case this one gets damaged.

Does anyone know if either 45510-MGH-641 or 45510-MGH-305 would work? Revzilla says that 305 won't fit a 2014. I'm hoping I can find a used assembly.

I have a hard time understanding how one could start with a perfectly fine looking screw (nobody would put another one in), and a perfectly fine screw-driver, and end up with what you are showing in the photo. Wrong material, or wrong procedure ? Any thoughts ?

[pekingduck]

Here is how what I would recommend.

Do not get another master cylinder. Order a new cap, diaphragm, and the spacer plate in between.
Use a hacksaw to cut across the top of the cap, and into part of the screw head. If you take any care at all, you won't even be cutting into the rubber.

Lift the large piece off, and make a small cut as shown. Now, with a small pair of pliers, the remaining pieces will just break off. The screw will be exposed so it can be twisted out, and the fluid will not have been exposed to air or contaminated.

[peterbaron]

Good alternative method!!

[GoldOxide_imp]

(dang) I remember doing this crap back in the early 80's and thought: Can't they engineer these reservoirs better?

Take the best of a chemical and mechanical engineer and make the issue go away? Maybe it has ... in outer space, but not in the civilian domain.

Heck, maybe not use "Phillips" screwheads might solve half the problem.

I have replaced all similar screws on my m/c with TORX screws (popularly called star bit screws). Problem gone forever. So may be you'll save the dollars for the engineers, and just do it

I have a "damaged screw remover set", cheap enough to buy and effective. Only used it once or twice but it did the job. You just need a reversing drill, preferably with speed control.

Is this set "noname" or some special brand ?

Well, I tried multiple options...
Removed the other screw and tried wiggling the cover - No movement.
Tried the rubber band - Gouged out more.
Tried hammering in a slotted screwdriver and twisting - It looked like the small screwdriver would break.

I took it to a local bike shop here (incidentally the same guys who last bled the brakes in 2018). The mechanic wasn't confident he could drill it without damaging the threads. The suggestion was to get a replacement reservoir just in case this one gets damaged.

Does anyone know if either 45510-MGH-641 or 45510-MGH-305 would work? Revzilla says that 305 won't fit a 2014. I'm hoping I can find a used assembly.

I have a hard time understanding how one could start with a perfectly fine looking screw (nobody would put another one in), and a perfectly fine screw-driver, and end up with what you are showing in the photo. Wrong material, or wrong procedure ? Any thoughts ?

I have replaced all similar screws on my m/c with TORX screws (popularly called star bit screws). Problem gone forever. So may be you'll save the dollars for the engineers, and just do it
Yeah, here we are in 2022 (deep into the 21st century folks) and some of the world is still using Phillips and equivalent fastener heads. Torx, Allen, and even the legendary Robertson are easy choices - but it is human to ignore better ways.

I suppose one could argue maybe we want the head to strip signifying that there is something fundamentally impairing the fastener and it is this frustration that alerts the mechanic of this plight.


(Not!)

[Wagonpeddler_imp]

Really...had an '05 Harley that I never really bonded with, however, it was covered with Torx head fasteners.

[Stichill_imp]

Stainless steel hex heads on my CBR250R with just a touch of copper anti-seize compound on the threads and under the heads. I sleep easy at night, knowing problem has been eliminated.

[GoldOxide_imp]

Stainless steel hex heads on my CBR250R with just a touch of copper anti-seize compound on the threads and under the heads. I sleep easy at night, knowing problem has been eliminated.

Ahem Hank.

[Stichill_imp]

(dang) I remember doing this crap back in the early 80's and thought: Can't they engineer these reservoirs better?

Take the best of a chemical and mechanical engineer and make the issue go away? Maybe it has ... in outer space, but not in the civilian domain.

Heck, maybe not use "Phillips" screwheads might solve half the problem.

I have replaced all similar screws on my m/c with TORX screws (popularly called star bit screws). Problem gone forever. So may be you'll save the dollars for the engineers, and just do it

I have a "damaged screw remover set", cheap enough to buy and effective. Only used it once or twice but it did the job. You just need a reversing drill, preferably with speed control.

Is this set "noname" or some special brand ?

Well, I tried multiple options...
Removed the other screw and tried wiggling the cover - No movement.
Tried the rubber band - Gouged out more.
Tried hammering in a slotted screwdriver and twisting - It looked like the small screwdriver would break.

I took it to a local bike shop here (incidentally the same guys who last bled the brakes in 2018). The mechanic wasn't confident he could drill it without damaging the threads. The suggestion was to get a replacement reservoir just in case this one gets damaged.

Does anyone know if either 45510-MGH-641 or 45510-MGH-305 would work? Revzilla says that 305 won't fit a 2014. I'm hoping I can find a used assembly.

I have a hard time understanding how one could start with a perfectly fine looking screw (nobody would put another one in), and a perfectly fine screw-driver, and end up with what you are showing in the photo. Wrong material, or wrong procedure ? Any thoughts ?

[ul] [li]Dissimilar metals[/li] [li]Galvanic corrosion[/li] [li]Maximum automatic assembly torque[/li] [li]No OEM anti-seize compound[/li] [li]Soft metal screws[/li] [li]Even proper JIS cross-head screwdrivers in good condition may fail to prevent cam-out for a seized screw[/li] [li]An area where Honda design succeeded in terms of cost control and mass production efficiency but failed in terms of maintainability
[/li][/ul]

[Tev62]

I have a "damaged screw remover set", cheap enough to buy and effective. Only used it once or twice but it did the job. You just need a reversing drill, preferably with speed control.

Is this set "noname" or some special brand ?

No, just regular German discount store, Aldi. It is from their "workzone brand".

(dang) I remember doing this crap back in the early 80's and thought: Can't they engineer these reservoirs better?

Take the best of a chemical and mechanical engineer and make the issue go away? Maybe it has ... in outer space, but not in the civilian domain.

Heck, maybe not use "Phillips" screwheads might solve half the problem.

I have replaced all similar screws on my m/c with TORX screws (popularly called star bit screws). Problem gone forever. So may be you'll save the dollars for the engineers, and just do it

I have a "damaged screw remover set", cheap enough to buy and effective. Only used it once or twice but it did the job. You just need a reversing drill, preferably with speed control.

Is this set "noname" or some special brand ?

Well, I tried multiple options...
Removed the other screw and tried wiggling the cover - No movement.
Tried the rubber band - Gouged out more.
Tried hammering in a slotted screwdriver and twisting - It looked like the small screwdriver would break.

I took it to a local bike shop here (incidentally the same guys who last bled the brakes in 2018). The mechanic wasn't confident he could drill it without damaging the threads. The suggestion was to get a replacement reservoir just in case this one gets damaged.

Does anyone know if either 45510-MGH-641 or 45510-MGH-305 would work? Revzilla says that 305 won't fit a 2014. I'm hoping I can find a used assembly.

I have a hard time understanding how one could start with a perfectly fine looking screw (nobody would put another one in), and a perfectly fine screw-driver, and end up with what you are showing in the photo. Wrong material, or wrong procedure ? Any thoughts ?

[ul] [li]Dissimilar metals[/li] [li]Galvanic corrosion[/li] [li]Maximum automatic assembly torque[/li] [li]No OEM anti-seize compound[/li] [li]Soft metal screws[/li] [li]Even proper JIS cross-head screwdrivers in good condition may fail to prevent cam-out for a seized screw[/li] [li]An area where Honda design succeeded in terms of cost control and mass production efficiency but failed in terms of maintainability
[/li][/ul]

[ul] [li]Dissimilar metals[/li] [li]Galvanic corrosion[/li] [li]Maximum automatic assembly torque[/li] [li]No OEM anti-seize compound[/li] [li]Soft metal screws[/li] [li]Even proper JIS cross-head screwdrivers in good condition may fail to prevent cam-out for a seized screw[/li] [li]An area where Honda design succeeded in terms of cost control and mass production efficiency but failed in terms of maintainability
[/li][/ul]
When at school (11-16 years old), we had a Chemistry teacher who really tried to make the class less boring. He used to bring in everyday objects, often dissimilar metal examples and how rust would shorten this items life by 10 years. He would often lament of the lack of chemistry skills taught in third level design institutions. I remember his lessons to this day.

After leaving school I joined the Merchant Navy (Merchant Marine) and one of my first jobs at sea was to enter these Cathedral size ballast tanks on VLCC's (Very Large Crude Carriers) Supertankers were tiny little ships by then. At the top end of the ballast tanks there were dozens of 5ft long Sacrificial Anodes, there to save the ships hull, there to do one job, take a hit for the team.

That day it was my job as the Cadet to decide if any needed replacing. I sat there in that huge murky empty tank, like I was at the bottom of some lost deep cave, my boilersuit wringing from sweat and the damp atmosphere and I thought of my old teacher and his wise words. I remember that old man, he will be long gone now but every time I see a poor design from a chemical perspective I salute "Bill", my old chemistry teacher.

[Stichill_imp]

I have a "damaged screw remover set", cheap enough to buy and effective. Only used it once or twice but it did the job. You just need a reversing drill, preferably with speed control.

Is this set "noname" or some special brand ?

No, just regular German discount store, Aldi. It is from their "workzone brand".

(dang) I remember doing this crap back in the early 80's and thought: Can't they engineer these reservoirs better?

Take the best of a chemical and mechanical engineer and make the issue go away? Maybe it has ... in outer space, but not in the civilian domain.

Heck, maybe not use "Phillips" screwheads might solve half the problem.

I have replaced all similar screws on my m/c with TORX screws (popularly called star bit screws). Problem gone forever. So may be you'll save the dollars for the engineers, and just do it

I have a "damaged screw remover set", cheap enough to buy and effective. Only used it once or twice but it did the job. You just need a reversing drill, preferably with speed control.

Is this set "noname" or some special brand ?

Well, I tried multiple options...
Removed the other screw and tried wiggling the cover - No movement.
Tried the rubber band - Gouged out more.
Tried hammering in a slotted screwdriver and twisting - It looked like the small screwdriver would break.

I took it to a local bike shop here (incidentally the same guys who last bled the brakes in 2018). The mechanic wasn't confident he could drill it without damaging the threads. The suggestion was to get a replacement reservoir just in case this one gets damaged.

Does anyone know if either 45510-MGH-641 or 45510-MGH-305 would work? Revzilla says that 305 won't fit a 2014. I'm hoping I can find a used assembly.

I have a hard time understanding how one could start with a perfectly fine looking screw (nobody would put another one in), and a perfectly fine screw-driver, and end up with what you are showing in the photo. Wrong material, or wrong procedure ? Any thoughts ?

[ul] [li]Dissimilar metals[/li] [li]Galvanic corrosion[/li] [li]Maximum automatic assembly torque[/li] [li]No OEM anti-seize compound[/li] [li]Soft metal screws[/li] [li]Even proper JIS cross-head screwdrivers in good condition may fail to prevent cam-out for a seized screw[/li] [li]An area where Honda design succeeded in terms of cost control and mass production efficiency but failed in terms of maintainability
[/li][/ul]

[ul] [li]Dissimilar metals[/li] [li]Galvanic corrosion[/li] [li]Maximum automatic assembly torque[/li] [li]No OEM anti-seize compound[/li] [li]Soft metal screws[/li] [li]Even proper JIS cross-head screwdrivers in good condition may fail to prevent cam-out for a seized screw[/li] [li]An area where Honda design succeeded in terms of cost control and mass production efficiency but failed in terms of maintainability
[/li][/ul]
When at school (11-16 years old), we had a Chemistry teacher who really tried to make the class less boring. He used to bring in everyday objects, often dissimilar metal examples and how rust would shorten this items life by 10 years. He would often lament of the lack of chemistry skills taught in third level design institutions. I remember his lessons to this day.

After leaving school I joined the Merchant Navy (Merchant Marine) and one of my first jobs at sea was to enter these Cathedral size ballast tanks on VLCC's (Very Large Crude Carriers) Supertankers were tiny little ships by then. At the top end of the ballast tanks there were dozens of 5ft long Sacrificial Anodes, there to save the ships hull, there to do one job, take a hit for the team.

That day it was my job as the Cadet to decide if any needed replacing. I sat there in that huge murky empty tank, like I was at the bottom of some lost deep cave, my boilersuit wringing from sweat and the damp atmosphere and I thought of my old teacher and his wise words. I remember that old man, he will be long gone now but every time I see a poor design from a chemical perspective I salute "Bill", my old chemistry teacher.

Great story, Tev! Amazing experience...sounds mildly terrifying to be honest! My similar experience at 18 years old was cleaning tramp oil out of a large water-based coolant tank underneath a D&I (draw & iron) press that made aluminum beverage cans. Dark, oily, filthy, and claustrophobic! Not fun!

Regarding screw repair, sometimes it's possible to take a 4 oz ball peen hammer and lightly tap the displaced metal back into the screwhead. It's best to use the ball end and that the ball be smoothly polished. Something I learned from a gunsmith.