Clutch/Brake fluid

[DBM_imp]

Make sure you soak the new fiber plates in oil before install, and deglaze the steel plates for best results.

[mattmcuomo@yahoo.com]

MMc just as a baseline i tried this test;
Bike with cold engine on center stand, rotate wheel by hand in neutral, put in first gear, pull in the clutch lever and"free up" the initial clutch drag.
After the initial clutch drag is overcome the wheel spins but i can feel increased drag from the clutch basket, by slowly releasing the handle the drag stays the same but increases after the first inch of the tip of the handle moves away from the handlebars and the clutch plates close the gap.
In other words the drag remains constant for the first 30% of the release and gradually increases over the remaining 70% of travel.

Sorry for harping on but i just want to help your situation, best wishes; Max

So, it sounds like you’re saying a little clutch drag could be “nature of the beast” so to say?


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[max]

Hi MMC, i think that if the plates are not smooth or have some buildup ( film ) on them for whatever reason this could be a simple way to check this and my comparison would give some way of knowing if the basket is clear or contaminated .

A friend of mine complained his clutch was "sticking" causing the engine to cut out, the plates appeared to have some drag so i did not confirm the complaint but trusted him and we took the sidecover off and inspected the plates, they were perfect and we put them back and closed the sidecover back on, put some new oil in the bike and tested it, turned out he did not realise the engine cut out with the sidestand out and shifting in first gear, of course it cut out!

This is not applicable to your situation i know but it illustrates that you can be too quick to take things apart before diagnosing exactly which part is faulty if at all.

I found it difficult to extract exactly what happens from your description so i came up with some basic tests to isolate the problem and some things to check.

As it stands i think your complaint is that the bike has difficulty shifting out of gear at a standstill, that could have many causes and has been complained about before.

You sound very capable and i just wanted to give you some measurements to compare with your own situation.

When changing brake fluid i was surprised at how a tiny bit of air can " soften " the brake action, once the last tiny bubbles were expelled it was all back to normal again, hence the measurement of the travel of the clutch plates, sometimes a vacuum type of bleeding brakes is required to suck out the fluid faster than the bubbles can rise to the top and remain in the system.

Our clutch system has such a dead spot just where the flexible hose connects to the solid pipe left forward of the fuel tank, if the hose is not held up to let the air rise to the top it can sit there compressing away preventing the plates to clear and separate completely.

This is the spot i mean;


If the air is not allowed to rise to the reservoir where it can get out by bending the flexible hose up ward and working the clutch lever it can sit there and be pushed back and forth limiting the travel of the clutchplates forever, just one of the possibilities.....

[GoldOxide_imp]

Very informative Max - thanks!

[mattmcuomo@yahoo.com]

Hi MMC, i think that if the plates are not smooth or have some buildup ( film ) on them for whatever reason this could be a simple way to check this and my comparison would give some way of knowing if the basket is clear or contaminated .

A friend of mine complained his clutch was "sticking" causing the engine to cut out, the plates appeared to have some drag so i did not confirm the complaint but trusted him and we took the sidecover off and inspected the plates, they were perfect and we put them back and closed the sidecover back on, put some new oil in the bike and tested it, turned out he did not realise the engine cut out with the sidestand out and shifting in first gear, of course it cut out!

This is not applicable to your situation i know but it illustrates that you can be too quick to take things apart before diagnosing exactly which part is faulty if at all.

I found it difficult to extract exactly what happens from your description so i came up with some basic tests to isolate the problem and some things to check.

As it stands i think your complaint is that the bike has difficulty shifting out of gear at a standstill, that could have many causes and has been complained about before.

You sound very capable and i just wanted to give you some measurements to compare with your own situation.

When changing brake fluid i was surprised at how a tiny bit of air can " soften " the brake action, once the last tiny bubbles were expelled it was all back to normal again, hence the measurement of the travel of the clutch plates, sometimes a vacuum type of bleeding brakes is required to suck out the fluid faster than the bubbles can rise to the top and remain in the system.

Our clutch system has such a dead spot just where the flexible hose connects to the solid pipe left forward of the fuel tank, if the hose is not held up to let the air rise to the top it can sit there compressing away preventing the plates to clear and separate completely.

This is the spot i mean;


If the air is not allowed to rise to the reservoir where it can get out by bending the flexible hose up ward and working the clutch lever it can sit there and be pushed back and forth limiting the travel of the clutchplates forever, just one of the possibilities.....

I’ll check that out. Thanks.


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[mattmcuomo@yahoo.com]

I checked through oil filler hole to see if clutch stays open with lever down, it does. I guess my next option is to open up the clutch to see what’s really going on. Thanks for all of your input everyone. I’ll update my findings when I can.


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[peterbaron]

Quick clutch test:
1. standing at the bottom of an incline ( min 40 ft)
2. be in the 2nd or 3rd gear and try to take off...if clutch is healthy, you should be able to make to the top ( bike will make a bit of an effort)
3. if you didn't , you already know, clutch slipping
4. this is NO or YES test if your problem is tricky or intermittent

[GoldOxide_imp]

Here's hoping this is something "dumb" and not too intensive. Good luck MMC.

[peterbaron]

Quick clutch test:
1. standing at the bottom of an incline ( min 40 ft)
2. be in the 2nd or 3rd gear and try to take off...if clutch is healthy, you should be able to make to the top ( bike will make a bit of an effort)
3. if you didn't , you already know, clutch slipping
4. this is NO or YES test if your problem is tricky or intermittent

CORRECTION TO #4
This is NOT a NO or YES test if your problem is tricky or intermittent

[max]

Thanks for checking the clutch plate movement MMC, here is a link to a careful German guy who takes the clutch out of a cb1300, which is very similar to our cb1100; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqE-VfjJIdU

Fast forward to 45 minutes into the 80 min. video for the clutch part.
In addition to that i suggest taking pictures and using a marker pen to facilitate correct re-assembly.

just in case