misterprofessionality
Road warrior
can confirm the presence of some leftover VFR1200 and VFR800 in some dealers. I just don't know what kept people from buying those, and frankly i'm aghast at Honda not including a V4 in more platforms.
ST vs FJR
- Thread starter LongRanger_imp
- Start date
the Ferret
Road warrior
Honda had a prototype sport tourer with an ST fairing and bags and a VFR 1200 motor. I had pictures of it at one time. IT was a great looking bike and I'm sure it would have been a great sport tourer but for some reason Honda abandoned the genre and let it die on the vine.
Cost, needless complexity, and a too-aggressive riding position.misterprofessionality_imp said:
Countless VFR owners TOLD Honda what they wanted, and Honda simply wouldn't listen. Instead, they continually jammed a bunch of excessive weight, cost, and complexity down our throats, in a package that was too narrowly focused to be comfortable for Older VFR Guy, i.e., the only person who could afford the new VFRs.
It was very simple. Here is all Honda needed to do to ensure the continued success of the VFR...
-Take the 2001 VFR800 and make it a full liter bike. Instead of 90-100 rwhp with 55-ft lbs of torque, give it Ninja 1000 hp and torque: 125 rwhp and 75-ft lbs of torque.
-NO V-TECH! Get your mitts off of our beloved gear-driven cams! THAT signature sound IS the VFR, and no one likes a big drop-off in power, smack-dab in the most important part of the power curve. V-Tech literally added nothing anyone wanted to the VFR experience. It sure hurt it, though.
-Keep the weight the same as the 2001 model, or even shave it down a bit, which wouldn't be difficult.
-Raise the bars to Ninja 1000 level, or, better yet, give them a range of adjustability, from the standard VFR position up to Ninja 1000 territory.
-Upside down forks, and a remote preload adjuster out back.
-Radial-mounted brakes. Not a deal killer, obviously, but at that price point people generally prefer radial brakes to those ancient CBR600F2-era units.
In a nutshell, give us a gear-driven cams, V4 Ninja 1000. Bestow it with the usual VFR panache and refinement. Don't price it into Ducati/BMW territory. That's all Honda had to do.
But no...
...again and again with that bike, no....
Instead, Honda just kept trying to answer questions absolutely no one was asking, until they finally managed to do the unthinkable, and kill the best motorcycle they or anyone else ever made.
LongRanger_imp
Road warrior
Thread starter
I would have liked to see the VTR engine in that package.
LikeAfox_imp
Running like a top
VLJ, wouldn't it be better to just ride a Concourse instead of trying to turn a VFR into one? Other than the engine, what makes it stand out?
I currently have a zg1000 and this discussion is about the next tier of motorcycles that I'm keeping my eyes on. Thanks everyone for your insight.
I currently have a zg1000 and this discussion is about the next tier of motorcycles that I'm keeping my eyes on. Thanks everyone for your insight.
A Concourse is a ginormous, shaft-driven land yacht with a big motor. It is not a sport bike in any way, shape, or form.
The VFR was always marketed as a real-world sportbike. Its bloodlines can be traced directly back to the V4 RC30 and RC45 race bikes. It's supposed to be a comfortable sportbike, not a smaller ST1100. in the same way that a Ninja 1000 is not a Concourse, neither should a VFR be.
The VFR was always marketed as a real-world sportbike. Its bloodlines can be traced directly back to the V4 RC30 and RC45 race bikes. It's supposed to be a comfortable sportbike, not a smaller ST1100. in the same way that a Ninja 1000 is not a Concourse, neither should a VFR be.
GoldOxide_imp
Road warrior
... mmmm, shaft drive.
LikeAfox_imp
Running like a top
Concourse weights the same as FJR and has underpinnings of ninja whatever sport bike, according to marketing materials. I was confused why you comparing ST with FJR and excluding Concourse and BMW K from that list. I'm not the only person who thinks soVLJ_imp said:
Personally I neither know nor care about sport bikes. Having ridden a handful, it's just not for me. However, neither is a Goldwing or Harley variants. I'm leaning towards adventure touring with Tenere front and center. Which is a different discussion, I guess.
the Ferret
Road warrior
Probably because I rode an ST for 10 years and 110,000 miles and last year picked up a new FJR and the OP wanted to know my opinion now that I have spent some time on the FJR.LikeAfox_imp said:
Yep. The only reason I mentioned the Concours (just realized we've been spelling it incorrectly this entire time, as there is no 'e' at the end) is because you (LikeAfox) mentioned the Concours. Otherwise, we were talking about the VFR, and how Honda ruined it. The majority of VFR People wanted it to remain a comfortable sportbike, only with more motor, and a more upright seating position, in the vein of the Ninja 1000. No one was asking for it to become an FJR/Concours/ST1300/R1200RT competitor.
LongRanger_imp
Road warrior
Thread starter
I owned a '91 Concours in the mid-90's and actually completed my first (and fastest) 1000/24 on it. At the time, the bike was compared against the ST1100 and K1100LT. In this category, the Honda was the bike to beat, while the Beemer lagged way behind. The FJR1100 was an also-ran. The best thing going for the Connie was its low price, good bags, large fuel capacity (hence my handle "LongRanger") and good looks. Until the bike was refreshed in 1994, the tires were an odd size and the camshafts were subject to galling and pitting, though I had zero issues in the 42,000 miles that I rode it.
Similar threads
