Rear Brake Fade?

[suhawk305]

Late last week into the weekend, I attended my 45th college reunion in the North Country of New York State (Potsdam, NY). The trip was 325 miles through the Catskills and Adirondacks Mountains. What a beautiful ride on my CB! (Too lazy to dismount and mount the CB with luggage to take pictures.)
In the Adirondacks, you have several fantastic miles between towns to enjoy. A lot of times, I had the road alone to ride the curves and hills at my pace.

Problem encountered:
When I rode into an Adirondack town, I slowed down by downshifting and normal brake use. When I came upon an intersection, I had no rear brake and had to anchor the front brake so I wouldn’t rear ended a Harley trike. Luckily, I was going slow so I didn’t lose control of the CB, but the front end dive and slight tire skid got my heart rate up.

This is the ‘14 Standard, 3K Miles with the original hydraulic fluids. It was taken out of its crate and delivered to me during May 2017.
My thoughts:
Maybe sitting with my luggage bag strapped to my luggage carrier and back half of my saddle cause my right foot on the brake peddle to slightly push the brake peddle down.

Or, an air bubble(s) in the hydraulics worked its way out.

Note I occasionally pumped my brake peddle for a while and the brakes slowly came back. No further problems for the remaining trip there, or my return trip home was encountered.

While I was in Potsdam, I took my CB to the local dealer and left it. He pulled the cover, inspected the hydraulics and test rode the CB and did not find any problems. I asked him if the original hydraulics should be flushed, and he said no. He advised me to occasionally test the rear brake while I was driving. I went to pay him and he said no charge, I left a tip.

Any thoughts? Does anyone else experienced a problem with the brake peddle being pressed while riding? I usually use the gearing more than brakes when riding curves and hills.

 

[SportsterDoc]

When this happened, how hot was the rotor?...that would verify or dispute your foot slightly on the brake pedal theory. Although I would expect to be able to smell the pads dragging.

 

[Lord Popgun]

At least 2 members (IIRC) had problems riding their rear brake. At least one overheated the rotor and warped it and, obvously, had to replace it.

Your bike is 4 years old. Brake and clutch fluid should be replaced every 2 years. Doesn’t matter if it was riden or sat in a crate.

Just because your dealer says the brakes are ok doesn’t mean they are. At least 4 members, including me, had air in the rear brake system from the get go. The dealers, including my service manager/head mech, said nothing was wrong. I bled mine and a lot of air came out. One member’s tech didn’t blow him off and flushed and bled the lines. You should flush and bleed yours. Its easy.

 

[SportsterDoc]

+1 with popgun on flushing.
What is the rotor color, compared to fronts?

 

[Townie_imp]

What's an easy and effective method to flush & bleed? I've only done it on a car, the cumbersome way, with a helper pressing the brake pedal while I unscrew the bleed screw. Then I screw the bleed screw back in before the helper releases the brake pedal. Repeat until flushed and/or bled. A bit of a hassle.

I've seen mention of brake bleeders that people leave installed, a small fitting with a check valve in it. And I've heard of "power bleeders" that has some sort of vacuum.

Suggestions to make it easy are welcome!

 

[SportsterDoc]

I evacuate most of the reservoir, add fresh fluid, then bleed the "cumbersome" way.
It is so infrequent, I chose to not invest in specialty tools.
Definitely not criticizing those who do.
But I still recall all the specialty tools I gave away when I closed Cycle Tuning Unlimited in the eighties. Not to mention pounds and pounds of metric fasteners that I should have kept!

 

[Cormanus]

I evacuate most of the reservoir, add fresh fluid, then bleed the "cumbersome" way.
It is so infrequent, I chose to not invest in specialty tools.
Definitely not criticizing those who do.
But I still recall all the specialty tools I gave away when I closed Cycle Tuning Unlimited in the eighties. Not to mention pounds and pounds of metric fasteners that I should have kept!

Curious way to measure metric items.

Just sayin’.

 

[SportsterDoc]

I evacuate most of the reservoir, add fresh fluid, then bleed the "cumbersome" way.
It is so infrequent, I chose to not invest in specialty tools.
Definitely not criticizing those who do.
But I still recall all the specialty tools I gave away when I closed Cycle Tuning Unlimited in the eighties. Not to mention pounds and pounds of metric fasteners that I should have kept!

Curious way to measure metric items.

Just sayin’.

Curious way to measure metric items.

Just sayin’.
Hmmm...how do you know I was not talking British monetary units?!

Your turn...

At least 2 members (IIRC) had problems riding their rear brake. At least one overheated the rotor and warped it and, obvously, had to replace it.

Your bike is 4 years old. Brake and clutch fluid should be replaced every 2 years. Doesn’t matter if it was riden or sat in a crate.

Just because your dealer says the brakes are ok doesn’t mean they are. At least 4 members, including me, had air in the rear brake system from the get go. The dealers, including my service manager/head mech, said nothing was wrong. I bled mine and a lot of air came out. One member’s tech didn’t blow him off and flushed and bled the lines. You should flush and bleed yours. Its easy.

When rotors or drums get very hot, such as from braking down a steep hill from a high speed, they are less likely to warp if the brakes are not applied after stopping, as the portion of the rotor or drum exposed to air cools faster than the portion to which the pads or shoes are applied.

 

[LongRanger_imp]

I evacuate most of the reservoir, add fresh fluid, then bleed the "cumbersome" way.
It is so infrequent, I chose to not invest in specialty tools.
Definitely not criticizing those who do.
But I still recall all the specialty tools I gave away when I closed Cycle Tuning Unlimited in the eighties. Not to mention pounds and pounds of metric fasteners that I should have kept!

Curious way to measure metric items.

Just sayin’.

Curious way to measure metric items.

Just sayin’. Good one! Rim shot!

 

[SportsterDoc]

This could get curiouser and curiouser!

 

[suhawk305]

I read all of your opinions and suggestions with interest. SportsterDoc - at the rear brake failure, I could not smell anything like the brake pads were hot. I had to ride a few miles to find a safe place to easily pull over. By the time I inspected the brakes, all parts were cool. The rotor color looks normal like the front rotors.
That bring me popgun’s suggestion to flush the hydraulics. I think this is definitely worth the effort, needs to be done anyway. Like Townie, I used the same simple technique to bleed the brake lines on automobiles. I assume I can do the same on the CB, both brake lines and clutch.

 

[SportsterDoc]

I read all of your opinions and suggestions with interest. SportsterDoc - at the rear brake failure, I could not smell anything like the brake pads were hot. I had to ride a few miles to find a safe place to easily pull over. By the time I inspected the brakes, all parts were cool. The rotor color looks normal like the front rotors.
That bring me popgun’s suggestion to flush the hydraulics. I think this is definitely worth the effort, needs to be done anyway. Like Townie, I used the same simple technique to bleed the brake lines on automobiles. I assume I can do the same on the CB, both brake lines and clutch.

Yes, same technique.

I read all of your opinions and suggestions with interest. SportsterDoc - at the rear brake failure, I could not smell anything like the brake pads were hot. I had to ride a few miles to find a safe place to easily pull over. By the time I inspected the brakes, all parts were cool. The rotor color looks normal like the front rotors.
That bring me popgun’s suggestion to flush the hydraulics. I think this is definitely worth the effort, needs to be done anyway. Like Townie, I used the same simple technique to bleed the brake lines on automobiles. I assume I can do the same on the CB, both brake lines and clutch.

The rotor would have cooled quickly, while moving.
If not discolored and no lateral run-out, then likely no harm to the rotor, if pads were applied.

 

[glenncal1_imp]

I would flush the brake fluid just because of your scenario, which sounds a lot like an overheat situation. That fluid is used

 

[Houtman_imp]

Speed bleeders and a vacuum bleeder with your compressor iece of cake !

 

[Townie_imp]

Speed bleeders and a vacuum bleeder with your compressor iece of cake !

I'd love to see a pic or explanation of that cake

 

[SportsterDoc]

Speed bleeders and a vacuum bleeder with your compressor iece of cake !

I'd love to see a pic or explanation of that cake

I'd love to see a pic or explanation of that cake
Well, it would be moist!

 

[suhawk305]

Update: I started by bleeding/flushing the clutch fluid the the old pumping, open/close bleeding screw, and the fluid bleeding stopped during the process. I must have accidentally introduced too much air in the clutch system. I got the shop manual out and saw that a vacuum bleeding tool was recommended. I got one from Harbor Freight that works with my compressor, as Houtman suggested. I was able to suck the air out and complete the flushing job.
I next did the the rear and front brakes, and it appeared that some air bubbles came out during the flush.
Took a short test drive and all systems worked.

I have to find out what “speed bleeders” are for the next time.

 

[the Ferret]

Good deal Suhawk!

 

[TCinNC_imp]

Update: I started by bleeding/flushing the clutch fluid the the old pumping, open/close bleeding screw, and the fluid bleeding stopped during the process. I must have accidentally introduced too much air in the clutch system. I got the shop manual out and saw that a vacuum bleeding tool was recommended. I got one from Harbor Freight that works with my compressor, as Houtman suggested. I was able to suck the air out and complete the flushing job.
I next did the the rear and front brakes, and it appeared that some air bubbles came out during the flush.
Took a short test drive and all systems worked.

I have to find out what “speed bleeders” are for the next time.

https://www.speedbleeder.com/
Just installed 4 of these on my bike. Flushed and put new fluid in both brakes and clutch. It’s a one person operation and very easy. If you use search on the forum you’ll find several threads on speed bleeders.