Opinion on frame damage

[MxHansen_imp]

Hello everyone,

This summer I had the unfortunate experience of lowsiding my CB1100 as a semi truck attempted to enter my lane and squish me. I had a set of crash bars that *seemed* to do their job, but today when I removed them I noticed some additional frame damage.

Initially the insurance company offered me the option of taking a "cosmetic damage" reimbursement for the frame, instead of a complete frame replacement - which would total the bike. But this was all before I took off the damaged crash bars.

Anyone care to give their opinion on this damage? I would really like to keep this bike, but if the frame is compromised I will let it go.

Here is the initial damage that insurance saw:

Here is a close up of what I found under the dented crash bar:

Interested in other's thoughts.
Thank you.

 

[GoldOxide_imp]

Hey MxHansen - sorry to learn about your mishap. Yikes, glad you can discuss it.

For some unknown reason I am unable to view the images at this time. Can you post them direct (limited to 250 kBs per image) or host them using a host image service like Imgur ?

Hopefully you'll find the best path forward regarding your answer. Welcome to the Forum.

 

[Cormanus]

Welcome to the forum, MxHansen. I’m sorry to hear of your mishap. Hard to be sure, but I think you’ve not given permission for others to view your Google pictures.

 

[pdedse]

Hello everyone,

This summer I had the unfortunate experience of lowsiding my CB1100 as a semi truck attempted to enter my lane and squish me. I had a set of crash bars that *seemed* to do their job, but today when I removed them I noticed some additional frame damage.

Initially the insurance company offered me the option of taking a "cosmetic damage" reimbursement for the frame, instead of a complete frame replacement - which would total the bike. But this was all before I took off the damaged crash bars.

Anyone care to give their opinion on this damage? I would really like to keep this bike, but if the frame is compromised I will let it go.

Here is the initial damage that insurance saw:

Here is a close up of what I found under the dented crash bar:

Interested in other's thoughts.
Thank you.

Have you spoken with the insurance company since removing the crashbars and seeing the damage? Is a shop involved? I would say an aduster / shop estimate need to be involved if not already. Perhaps you have this in mind.

I had the following experience with a shop and a boat: the shop was working with the insurance adjuster and they gave an original estimate of X amount of dollars. The insurance company agreed to the estimate. After tearing into the boat, the shop encouraged me to contact the adjuster again because there was additional damage that they couldn't see from original estimate. The insurance company contacted the shop, they hashed out the details and the original estimate was substantially increased to cover the hidden damage.

 

[Houtman_imp]

I had the same issue as the above , truck tire exploded in front of me on I 26 just outside Charleston SC . Initial damage was quite a lot but more damage found when taking parts of the CRV. Insurance company made good on it as extra costs added to the original estimate.

 

[MxHansen_imp]

Sorry for the issues with the pictures; let's see if this works.

Initial damage seen by the insurance company:



Additional damage from crash bars compressing into frame:
[url=https://imgur.com/d35aYwR]

Here is a wider angle showing both spots:
[url=https://imgur.com/zChs2tu]

Is it safe to assume that this frame is significantly compromised?
Thank you for the replies, I appreciate it.

MX

 

[Gone in 60]

That crack looks like it's on a weld (middle photo). Is that the case? If so, it's probably compromised now, but maybe a welding shop could repair it. However, if that is indeed the case, your insurance company may elect to just total the bike based on a cracked weld on the frame, while they could see a scrape and minor dent as a cosmetic issue.

 

[Enzofour_imp]

It doesn't look like structural damage to me, if you're not sure go to a good coachbuilder, you'll see that he fixes it perfectly.

 

[GoldOxide_imp]

Dang, yeah. The engine guard incited the compromised weld? Insurance company should review that.

 

[MxHansen_imp]

That crack looks like it's on a weld (middle photo). Is that the case? If so, it's probably compromised now, but maybe a welding shop could repair it. However, if that is indeed the case, your insurance company may elect to just total the bike based on a cracked weld on the frame, while they could see a scrape and minor dent as a cosmetic issue.

That crack is *right on* the weld unfortunately. The crash bar compressed the tube, kinda makes me wonder....what is the point of the crash bar if its just going to thrash the frame. Oh well, I walked away from the crash, grateful for that.

Thank you for the reply.
Mx

 

[Gone in 60]

I'd say you've got two choices. Talking as a former insurance adjuster, a crack on a weld would probably warrant frame replacement, and would most likely total your bike. You could choose to take the settlement and buy the bike back with a salvage title, which will follow the bike for the rest of its life.

Or, you could take your chances by keeping the additional damage from the insurance company, and having a welding shop repair the frame. That is if a shop would even take on the work... they may not due to the inherent risk of repairing a damaged frame. If a shop says that they can do it and will, you'd keep a clean title. Clean up the weld, repaint the damaged areas, and go from there.

Tough choice either way, especially if you really love your bike.

 

[MxHansen_imp]

I'd say you've got two choices. Talking as a former insurance adjuster, a crack on a weld would probably warrant frame replacement, and would most likely total your bike. You could choose to take the settlement and buy the bike back with a salvage title, which will follow the bike for the rest of its life.

Or, you could take your chances by keeping the additional damage from the insurance company, and having a welding shop repair the frame. That is if a shop would even take on the work... they may not due to the inherent risk of repairing a damaged frame. If a shop says that they can do it and will, you'd keep a clean title. Clean up the weld, repaint the damaged areas, and go from there.

Tough choice either way, especially if you really love your bike.

That the meat of the issue right there. I absolutely love this bike and I'm not confident that insurance will pay out enough to buy another CB with the low miles.

 

[Frulk_imp]

If it was my bike and that was the only issue…cracked weld. I’d have no concern finding a QUALITY welder ( there are several aerospace aircraft workers around where I live) and having them weld that.

Maybe for extra measure pull off the exhaust behind it and weld a metal strap lengthwise to provide it additional support in the area. Get OEM touch up paint and then I’d ride it without a second thought. Bike is a jewel with an overbuilt motor as solid as an anvil

 

[max]

Looking at this from an electrical/electronic angle you need to be aware that if there is some welding work done the electronics on the bike ( ecu, meter panel, battery and rectifier just to name a few ) need to be disconnected from the frame ( and verified with an ohm meter).
The frame can act as a transformer in some cases depending how current flows and to have a good weld only to find out something is now not working anymore is something to avoid despite the fact that there are only two earth points in the system, i could be wrong but just something to consider which may not seem obvious, anybody?

 

[pekingduck]

Is the weld actually cracked, or is it just a deep indented gouge? Either way, I'd just weld it like Frulk and others say, and never worry about it again. Since they're going to touch up the other scratches, have them paint that spot too.

 

[MxHansen_imp]

Would anyone be able to let me know if the bolt/bracket circled in red is supposed to have this split in it? Thank you in advance.

 

[SportsterDoc]

Yes, research counter-balance adjustment.

Looking at this from an electrical/electronic angle you need to be aware that if there is some welding work done the electronics on the bike ( ecu, meter panel, battery and rectifier just to name a few ) need to be disconnected from the frame ( and verified with an ohm meter).
The frame can act as a transformer in some cases depending how current flows and to have a good weld only to find out something is now not working anymore is something to avoid despite the fact that there are only two earth points in the system, i could be wrong but just something to consider which may not seem obvious, anybody?

Or braze instead of weld?
For those recommending welding, what is the expected failure?
No attempt at sarcasm, just asking.

 

[MxHansen_imp]

Is the weld actually cracked, or is it just a deep indented gouge? Either way, I'd just weld it like Frulk and others say, and never worry about it again. Since they're going to touch up the other scratches, have them paint that spot too.

It appears to just be a deep dent.

Looking at this from an electrical/electronic angle you need to be aware that if there is some welding work done the electronics on the bike ( ecu, meter panel, battery and rectifier just to name a few ) need to be disconnected from the frame ( and verified with an ohm meter).
The frame can act as a transformer in some cases depending how current flows and to have a good weld only to find out something is now not working anymore is something to avoid despite the fact that there are only two earth points in the system, i could be wrong but just something to consider which may not seem obvious, anybody?

Thank you for the insightful reply, I really appreciate it.
Mx

If it was my bike and that was the only issue…cracked weld. I’d have no concern finding a QUALITY welder ( there are several aerospace aircraft workers around where I live) and having them weld that.

Maybe for extra measure pull off the exhaust behind it and weld a metal strap lengthwise to provide it additional support in the area. Get OEM touch up paint and then I’d ride it without a second thought. Bike is a jewel with an overbuilt motor as solid as an anvil

Fair enough, thank you for the reply.

 

[jtopiso_imp]

I'd have it profesionally welded by someone who can certify the welding. Welding a structure is not like welding pipes.

You will need material specification of the frame, and depending on the material, the welder will tell you if it can or can't be done. Some high strength tubing (such as 4130, frequently used in aerospace and motorsport suspension or rollcages) requires heattreament after welding, as the metal becomes brittle after welding if it's not heat-treated afterwards. This means that, if it was 4130 (or similar), it would crack around the new welds under load.

I'd be surprised if honda is using a tubing that requires heat-treatment after welding (it would be very expensive for them to manufacture, and they would be selling a virtually "non repairable" frame), but I think it's worth checking.

 

[j3gq_imp]

Hello Mx, there are many shades of gray, and your frame is one of them. Many useful comments have already been made. But there is still one aspect which hasn't been worked out. You do not want to invest into this work without 100% insurance that a) the fix will last and b) the symmetry of the frame is preserved after the work is done.
My take, the bike's frame has to be striped of all other parts (that is expensive or time-consuming), another cradle (frame) needs to be build which allows to hold the bike's frame while welding AND allows sub-millimeter measurements of the position of a number of critical points on the frame. Whether your welder tells you this same story (or not) is one way for you to tell about his seriousness.

That crack looks like it's on a weld (middle photo). Is that the case? If so, it's probably compromised now, but maybe a welding shop could repair it. However, if that is indeed the case, your insurance company may elect to just total the bike based on a cracked weld on the frame, while they could see a scrape and minor dent as a cosmetic issue.

That crack is *right on* the weld unfortunately. The crash bar compressed the tube, kinda makes me wonder....what is the point of the crash bar if its just going to thrash the frame. Oh well, I walked away from the crash, grateful for that.

Thank you for the reply.
Mx