New owner... Vibrations.. And a question

[Lord Popgun]

Those bar end screws are ALOC fasteners and the book says to replace them after removal. ALOC fasteners just have a thread locker on them. Just use some medium locker on them and they should be OK.

Vibration— Is it possible your counter balance needs adjustment? It is easy to do. I don’t know if it would cause vibration or just be noisy though.

 

[lazz_imp]

Those bar end screws are ALOC fasteners and the book says to replace them after removal. ALOC fasteners just have a thread locker on them. Just use some medium locker on them and they should be OK.

Vibration— Is it possible your counter balance needs adjustment? It is easy to do. I don’t know if it would cause vibration or just be noisy though.

thanks for your input

workshop manual says work on the balancer requires engine removal... Or am I missing something?

OOPS ignore me, I found it. Thanks for the tip, will definitely give it a go

 

[peterbaron]

Not for adjustment...

 

[lazz_imp]

UPDATE

thank you ever so much Lord Popgun.

I performed the adjustment, it appears to me that the balancer was on the loose side.

From the very small ride I can perform around the yard, it definitely seems to have improved matters somewhat, but hard to be sure until I take it out for a longer test.

I'll take it out in the morning to go and get some BBs for the handlebars and um.. update this update

cheers

 

[Lord Popgun]

Sometimes I have a clue. Sometimes I don’t know there are clues!

I hope that does it, or at least helps some.

 

[rboe]

Two CB's, the '13 & '14 both like to see the bar weight screws like to back out. Even with thread locker. Kinda annoying.

I used to get a bit of a buzz around 70 mph in top gear but in either bike now I don't notice the vibes any more so perhaps a bit of a break in period does help. The balancer was completely off my radar so I hope sorting that cures your problem.

Very keen on seeing how this plays out for you.

I was going to suggest that perhaps an injector was not working properly, leading to lower power in that cylinder and leading to a vibration. Probably a bit of a reach but there you go! Good luck!

 

[dave]

After reading all the posts I am going to go out on a limb and suggest that Lazz's bike has a problem. I ride my 2014 Deluxe in the 70 mph to 85 mph range on our California freeways all the time and I have never noticed any unusual or excessive vibration. (I know this is not as fast as Lazz rides, but that the fastest I can tolerate for any length of time on an unfaired bike). I suggest finding another CB1100 Honda owner and swapping bikes for a ride to see if there is any difference in the two bikes.

 

[Olof_imp]

Sorry if this has been covered before, but 've heard more than once that exhaust systems mounted in tension may transmit quite some vibrations to the frame. Remedy:

1. loosen exhaust system mounting points,
2. start bike and let idle for a few minutes,
3. re-tension mounting points.

The logic beeing that the loose system settles in its favoured (least stress) position and this allows the rubber mountings to better do their job. I've not tried this on the CB1100RS - although I do admit it vibrates annoyingly much, almost too the point of being a showstopper - but on other bikes I imagine that it made a difference.

Again, sorry if stating the obvious/already covered.

 

[Lord Popgun]

Those are good points Olof. I would think it could be a lot of things-tires/wear balance, loose head bearings, wheel alignment or not true, forks not aligned properly. IDK. Remember one member had a swingarm that was loose in the frame and had to deal with that. He had to shim it to get it right.

When these bikes first came out in the US and UK someone started a UK board. This board had not been started then. Ferret and I were on it, and some others. Anyway one guy in the UK had either a noise or vibration that turned out to be (we think, Honda was cagey about it) counter balancer problem. They pulled the engine and replaced the balancer, or something, and he was good. I’d check as many things as I could.

That UK CB site never had much traffic and once Guth put up this site, it faded away and this one took off.

 

[lazz_imp]

Thanks guys,

I'm in contact with the dealer, I still have full factory warranty, so if there is a fault I should be covered...

I did another 3 hour ride yesterday, some city, some A-roads and about an hour on the highway. It's a truly bizarre experience. On the highway, 80-90mph in top gear puts you right in the no go area of the rev range (where it vibes so bad that your hands would be a goner in around 15mins if you stayed there.)

BUT if you drop 2 cogs you end up at 5K where its noticeably smoother

or even shift all the way to 3rd, you end up at 6K where it's REALLY smooth

...and deceptively fast! like glance down at the speedo and you're suddenly cruising at 100-110mph, an absolute 'gentlemans express'...

keeps getting smoother as the revs increase too

but, as soon as I need to slow down back to say 65-75 I found myself pulling the clutch in, letting the speed drop and then flicking 2 or 3 gears back up to 6th and clutching back in at 3k

sounds crazy? It is....

It's a really weird feeling, going down the highway at 70mph in top gear and knowing that you are limited by a nasty buzz from the engine.
'

I can't really explain why that rev range should be so rough, and yet the bike be so smooth at higher and lower rpms. I know every engine has it's rough point, but this is the most extreme version I've ever encountered

I kept asking myself, how would I be riding this thing differently if it wasn't for the vibraions, and the answer is, I would be riding in a much less complicated way!!

City work was great though, fizzing along at 2- 2.5k and yes, feeling the programmed 'character'

Oh and regarding the high speeds, I made a fairing many years ago that 99 per cent eliminates wind blast (for me) at highway speeds and luckily it slips straight on to the Honda!


Will keep you updated...

 

[Cormanus]

Others have complained about vibrations in the 3-4K range, but not for some time.

 

[GoldOxide_imp]

After reading all the posts I am going to go out on a limb and suggest that Lazz's bike has a problem. I ride my 2014 Deluxe in the 70 mph to 85 mph range on our California freeways all the time and I have never noticed any unusual or excessive vibration. (I know this is not as fast as Lazz rides, but that the fastest I can tolerate for any length of time on an unfaired bike). I suggest finding another CB1100 Honda owner and swapping bikes for a ride to see if there is any difference in the two bikes.

Yeah, if possible, this is a practical idea worth exploring.

 

[j3gq_imp]

lazz, really sorry to hear about this problem. As others said, there could be many reasons. But you would certainly go from doing ALL the easy/cheap tests, before tackling more difficult/expensive solutions. May be taken the engine apart is the only solution - but it is certainly the last ever considered. Now this said - unless you park her in the dealers yard and he is willing to fix it for you (which I doubt) ... if it was my bike, and after all you did already, I would do the following:
- first ask the dealer to use his connections, and organize a ride on another CB for me, just to be sure (that you can feel the difference),
- you said it's rpm/s not speed, so go to that rpm range in third gear (not higher !), pull the clutch AND keep the throttle open so the rpm doesn't fall off, what happens ? same vibrations, or less, repeat until you are sure;
- it can be rpm/s and NOT be the engine, we need to know for sure, which is very difficult to say at high speed and rpm/s with your hands tortured;
- strap several accelero-meters (best the recording type) to places like fork, engine, tail etc. and get the frequency spectrum read-outs for each to compare. where is the problem located, what is just resonating, resonances, all objectively (your wrists may just be more sensitive than other body parts; have some one who knows these devices check the read-outs for you.
If you don't know how to do this, there may be guys at the race track or (if you are near water) the power boat guys who may be willing to help with this. If not, local mechanics department at the university.

 

[lazz_imp]

lazz, really sorry to hear about this problem. As others said, there could be many reasons. But you would certainly go from doing ALL the easy/cheap tests, before tackling more difficult/expensive solutions. May be taken the engine apart is the only solution - but it is certainly the last ever considered. Now this said - unless you park her in the dealers yard and he is willing to fix it for you (which I doubt) ... if it was my bike, and after all you did already, I would do the following:
- first ask the dealer to use his connections, and organize a ride on another CB for me, just to be sure (that you can feel the difference),
- you said it's rpm/s not speed, so go to that rpm range in third gear (not higher !), pull the clutch AND keep the throttle open so the rpm doesn't fall off, what happens ? same vibrations, or less, repeat until you are sure;
- it can be rpm/s and NOT be the engine, we need to know for sure, which is very difficult to say at high speed and rpm/s with your hands tortured;
- strap several accelero-meters (best the recording type) to places like fork, engine, tail etc. and get the frequency spectrum read-outs for each to compare. where is the problem located, what is just resonating, resonances, all objectively (your wrists may just be more sensitive than other body parts; have some one who knows these devices check the read-outs for you.
If you don't know how to do this, there may be guys at the race track or (if you are near water) the power boat guys who may be willing to help with this. If not, local mechanics department at the university.

Thanks for that

Will try pulling the clutch even though I'm 99 per cent certain its the motor, it can't hurt to have more info...

I got a very experienced motorcycle mechanic friend (40 years experience) to ride it today and another friend who has ridden only Japanese I4s for about 15 years, they were both amazed at how rough it was.

In the affected rev range the resonance is very very strong. A lot more than one might get from a loose or overtensioned exhaust.

It can be felt everywhere, the seat, pegs and the tank as well as the handlebars.

It is definitely rpm related and not vehicle speed related.

The accelero-meters road sounds really interesting. I'm less enthusiastic about that than I might otherwise be as I have a LOT of work on this year, so I just can't let this become too much of a project... I bought the Honda hoping to just turn the key and ride. (I have rebuilt a fair few engines and gearboxes, made custom wiring looms etc in my time so I'm no stranger to projects!!)

A question for everyone that has me stumped, how does the balance shaft adjuster actually work? It was easy to set, but I'm having a bit of trouble visualising what's going on inside the carnkcase when the adjustments are made. And the parts book is not too enlightening...

Thanks everyone

 

[j3gq_imp]

Do very well understand the “project“ problem. Is there a chance to simply return the bike to the dealer for a refund ? Politely Tell him about the bad press this will generate for him online and in town, and twist his arms a little ... offer to buy another one from him ... and turn it into a win-win ?
I am sure you thought about this too, but needed some moral support

 

[michael1954]

Hi everyone,

recently bought a CB1100EX 6speed that had just been run in.

I really like the bike in all respects and it seems perfect for my needs.

Except, on my bike, the constant vibrations/buzz in the midrange (from 3K to 5K) are intensely intrusive. To the extent that on a recent 3 hour run, my hands and feet were buzzing for several hours afterwards. I was wearing full riding gear.

I have been riding for 20 years, everything form old brits to racing ducatis with many guzzis in between and a fair few inline 4s. My daily round town ride up until now has been a 1970 Triumph twin and that causes me no problems in terms of vibration! (I mean the thumping vibration is there, but it is transient, unlike the constant buzz on my new honda) Heck, I've been using a 1960s guzzi police bike for the past 4 years for my long distance work.... So I don't believe I'm overly sensitive to vibrations.

I use a motorcycle as my primary mode of transport and ride far and often.

There are a few others who have complained about vibration on this forum and many who haven't, what I'm trying to figure out is whether my particular bike has a fault or if this is just a characteristic of the model.

Do you all just keep the revs under 3k?

Does anybody out there have a bike that is smooth between 3K and 5K?

Any info/data points gratefully appreciated

Ride safe,

Hi, and welcome. I replaced the bar end weights with heavier ones off Ebay. I had not really noticed that much vibrations, but the heavier weights helped with what little I felt.

 

[jtopiso_imp]

sounds like the balance shaft is 180deg out of phase...

 

[Lord Popgun]

Lazz, the balancer is a gear driven weight. The adjustment is for adjusting gear lash.

Jt, if it is out of phase, someone was having a bad day. It has an alignment mark on the weight and crankcase for proper installation. This can be seen in the service manual. Plus some other assembly details for putting the parts on the shaft, etc.

 

[Whoops]

Watch the second half of this video…

Not having RLET’s is known to cause a rough vibration in certain parts of the bar ends though.

 

[lazz_imp]

Lazz, the balancer is a gear driven weight. The adjustment is for adjusting gear lash.

Jt, if it is out of phase, someone was having a bad day. It has an alignment mark on the weight and crankcase for proper installation. This can be seen in the service manual. Plus some other assembly details for putting the parts on the shaft, etc.

Thankyou!