never, never brands

[The Gecko_imp]

I know you all like Honda, but I am curious:
IF you had to pay with your own money, and no discounts to the market price - which common brand motorcycle(s) would you never ever buy ?

 

[Tev62]

KTM - just too many poor reliability stories out there. I know there will be many that say they never had a problem with theirs but there are far too many that do. The motorcycle press seem to turn a blind eye to it too, can't miss out on the latest bike launch in sunny Sardinia! When you see one year old 1290 Super Adventure S's in the dealers you just know why. I've met two 1290 owners here who said never again.

 

[the Ferret]

Pay for with my money?

BMW
Ducati
KTM
Moto Guzzi
Royal Enfield
Aprilia
Norton
Indian
Harley

Basically, anything Euro except Triumph, and neither of the two big American bikes

I would buy any of the 4 Japanese brands

I would maybe buy a Zero.... if ......... (more range, lower cost)...... but ay 74 years old, they will never have the "if" in what's left of my riding lifetime

 

[misterprofessionality]

I can agree with all of those except for KTM....i did buy one with my own money, (one of the ones that was made in india no less) and it was a peach. a huge surprise. I didn't expect it to be so high quality but it was, against all odds. Poor thing didn't deserve what happened to it. There's definitely another KTM or Husqvarna in my future.

BMW and ducati are on the edge of buyable but ultimately it's the cost of maintenance that has me never ever buying those brands.

Moto Guzzi just....doesn't have anything to offer me. I really don't think there's anything at all wrong with their bikes, they just haven't made anything that makes me want to buy it. The closest thing was the Mandello S but it ultimately falls short of being competitive in its size and price range. I know that's gonna get me flamed here with the Guzzi guys haha.

Enfield has a long way to go in the quality department but boy are they cheap. You could almost get away with buying one because of the low risk involved.

Aprillia is a fire hazard

Norton is a pump and dump scheme

Polaris and Harley are the same story. Low effort high cost products that ultimately just want you to buy them because "america"

Here's the really shocking hot take though....I think I may never ever buy another Honda. after the CB1100 i just don't think they have anything to offer me. much like Moto Guzzi, just with a higher quality machine. While i have great respect for everything Honda makes, i find myself not really wanting any of it.

 

[Gone in 60]

Hmm... interesting topic.

To misterprofessionality's point, Royal Enfield does have a ways to go in quality, but it's a bike built to a price, and that price is cheap. I initially dismissed the Interceptor 650 as a "Harbor Freight Bonneville", but once I spent a day on a rental and became intrigued, and then looked at how cheap used bikes were with minimal mileage, I decided that yes the risk was low enough for the bike itself, but was concerned about parts availability. I priced commonly replaced parts on Ebay India before I pulled the trigger, and found them to be laughably cheap. So far, I've paid $24 to replace a speedometer cable. Valve checks are called for every 6k miles, but the tank comes off in minutes, and it has screw lash adjusters. I can do that in an hour with a cocktail in one hand.

Regarding BMW... Ugh, yeah, lovely, and initially the logical and practical German engineering was uber-kool, but when German stuff breaks, it does so in spectacular fashion. Been there, done that, love-em as rentals now, but it's nice to hand the keys back over when I'm done.

Moto Guzzi... I'd love a V7 850. But I'm hesitant... the appeal for me is like the Enfield 650, but I don't think the parts would be as cheap or easy to get.

KTM... my friends have 'em and love 'em, but the slanty, slashy orange/black styling just doesn't grab me.

What would I just not buy? A Harley or an Indian. I did my cruiser thing years ago, and just don't enjoy riding big, heavy yachts anymore. Yeah, Indian has the FTR, but it's not something that speaks to me enough.. maybe it's the price tag.

 

[1973cb750]

never buy ? ktm, Harley, china brands, appirla

 

[Charlie Bravo_imp]

I already have what I would buy; a great all-around 2013 Honda CB1100 and a nice cruiser 2009 Yamaha V-Star1300

 

[dave]

Anything from China. Would never purchase a Ducati because of the maintenance. I was talking to a Ducati representative at the Ducati display at the Laguna Seca race track, and I asked him how long it took to perform a valve adjustment on the two cylinder, Penagale, and he stated "It would take 12 1/2 hours for a trained, Ducati technician to perform a valve adjustment." And I thought performing a valve adjustment for my CB1100 was a lot of work!

 

[Gone in 60]

As to the anything from China sentiment, I've seen one of our local multi-brand dealers go heavy on CF Moto. If you visit Delamo Motorsports in Tustin, you have to pass a phalanx of CF Moto bikes to get to Honda, Kawi, Yamaha and everything else. I've looked at them, and have to say that the quality doesn't look bad, but I'm not ready, even though I've got an Indian Enfield and a Malaysian Triumph. Also means that I've seen a growing number of those new CF bikes on the road from that dealer. When I can catch an owner, the first comment is always "Yeah, I know, right? Never thought I'd buy a Chinese bike. But I gotta say for the price, it's pretty nice".

You get the feeling that those owners figure another rider's first comment is going to be about the bike's origin, and having bought one, they're ready to defend it.

 

[clearviewx]

HARLEY DAVIDSON

 

[Yata-Garasu_imp]

As to the anything from China sentiment, I've seen one of our local multi-brand dealers go heavy on CF Moto. If you visit Delamo Motorsports in Tustin, you have to pass a phalanx of CF Moto bikes to get to Honda, Kawi, Yamaha and everything else. I've looked at them, and have to say that the quality doesn't look bad, but I'm not ready, even though I've got an Indian Enfield and a Malaysian Triumph. Also means that I've seen a growing number of those new CF bikes on the road from that dealer. When I can catch an owner, the first comment is always "Yeah, I know, right? Never thought I'd buy a Chinese bike. But I gotta say for the price, it's pretty nice".

You get the feeling that those owners figure another rider's first comment is going to be about the bike's origin, and having bought one, they're ready to defend it.

I'm fairly certain all Triumphs are built in Thailand now. Never heard of them making any in Malaysia.

Interesting article...

Where was your Triumph motorcycle made?

I spent a summer in Thailand many years ago and those folks LOVE MOTORCYCLES!

Since the average Thai person is physically much smaller than the average Brit or American, they tend to lean towards the smaller displacement bikes, but Triumph has been making serious inroads into Thailand's premium market.

Many of Honda's newer small to midsize models are made in Thailand as well. For example, the CB500. I am not afraid of Thai manufacturing as long as it's manufacturing motorcycles!

Sorry for the brief hijack!

 

[Cormanus]

I don't think anyone should be afraid of overseas manufacturing unless there's real evidence that it's a problem. Such evidence should be more than heresay from a forum or somebody's conversation in the pub. So much of what we use to today is effectively manufactured overseas — think, most tech, cars, motorcycles — for the simple reason that labour's cheaper.

 

[Gone in 60]

As to the anything from China sentiment, I've seen one of our local multi-brand dealers go heavy on CF Moto. If you visit Delamo Motorsports in Tustin, you have to pass a phalanx of CF Moto bikes to get to Honda, Kawi, Yamaha and everything else. I've looked at them, and have to say that the quality doesn't look bad, but I'm not ready, even though I've got an Indian Enfield and a Malaysian Triumph. Also means that I've seen a growing number of those new CF bikes on the road from that dealer. When I can catch an owner, the first comment is always "Yeah, I know, right? Never thought I'd buy a Chinese bike. But I gotta say for the price, it's pretty nice".

You get the feeling that those owners figure another rider's first comment is going to be about the bike's origin, and having bought one, they're ready to defend it.

I'm fairly certain all Triumphs are built in Thailand now. Never heard of them making any in Malaysia.

Interesting article...

Where was your Triumph motorcycle made?

I spent a summer in Thailand many years ago and those folks LOVE MOTORCYCLES!

Since the average Thai person is physically much smaller than the average Brit or American, they tend to lean towards the smaller displacement bikes, but Triumph has been making serious inroads into Thailand's premium market.

Many of Honda's newer small to midsize models are made in Thailand as well. For example, the CB500. I am not afraid of Thai manufacturing as long as it's manufacturing motorcycles!

Sorry for the brief hijack!

I'm fairly certain all Triumphs are built in Thailand now. Never heard of them making any in Malaysia.

Interesting article...

Where was your Triumph motorcycle made?

I spent a summer in Thailand many years ago and those folks LOVE MOTORCYCLES!

Since the average Thai person is physically much smaller than the average Brit or American, they tend to lean towards the smaller displacement bikes, but Triumph has been making serious inroads into Thailand's premium market.

Many of Honda's newer small to midsize models are made in Thailand as well. For example, the CB500. I am not afraid of Thai manufacturing as long as it's manufacturing motorcycles!

Sorry for the brief hijack!

Wait, you’re right, it is Thailand. I think it was my CB300R that was made in Malaysia. As far as Triumphs, I think the new 400 singles come from India. Really look well put together. A dealer near my weekend gig offered me a test ride next time I swing by. Definitely going to take them up on it.

 

[cookiemech]

I'll never buy a motorcycle made in China, and that includes BMWs made there (I own four BMWs, all made in Germany, as they should be for the price).

Never ever another Moto Guzzi (have owned two). First was a V-50 III, second worst piece of junk I ever owned (#1 is the Ural I currently own). Moto Guzzi doesn't support its dealers or customers in terms of parts and warranty service, in my experience. Good designs poorly executed.

No Aprilias, though it really doesn't matter, as they don't make anything for my types of riding. From what I am reading, they have treated employees pretty badly lately.

No more Urals. I am on my second (first was a terribly rusty 2014 Gear Up, gifted to me, that I completely refurbished over a winter, so its failings might not have been representative). I bought my current Gear Up new in 2020. It has had more (and serious) failures than ALL of the motorcycles I've owned in 45 years. Ural loyalists love to make excuses for the brand, but they are just plain junk. Only reason I still have it is that there is no other sidecar motorcycle that is manufactured as such. I do not want a sidecar that is grafted onto a motorcycle (which is not designed to work with a sidecar). Again, a Ural is a good design, but horribly executed. Very poor quality control (or none at all).

Funny to see all the negativity about Harleys. Expensive, yes, but in my experience (I've had five and currently own two), the quality of late model ones is high and once owned, easy and cheap to maintain if you do your own work.

I'd own any of the four Japanese brands, any (older) BMW (obviously), modern Triumphs (I've had old ones and they are beautiful, but no, thanks), and a Ducati (had a Monster 1200 that was truly gorgeous and well-built, but that type of riding just isn't for me; the quality was superb though).

Oh, no Royal Enfields from what I've seen. Cheap. I don't like cheap and I can afford better. Nice looking bikes, though.

 

[misterprofessionality]

I'll never buy a motorcycle made in China, and that includes BMWs made there (I own four BMWs, all made in Germany, as they should be for the price).

Never ever another Moto Guzzi (have owned two). First was a V-50 III, second worst piece of junk I ever owned (#1 is the Ural I currently own). Moto Guzzi doesn't support its dealers or customers in terms of parts and warranty service, in my experience. Good designs poorly executed.

No Aprilias, though it really doesn't matter, as they don't make anything for my types of riding. From what I am reading, they have treated employees pretty badly lately.

No more Urals. I am on my second (first was a terribly rusty 2014 Gear Up, gifted to me, that I completely refurbished over a winter, so its failings might not have been representative). I bought my current Gear Up new in 2020. It has had more (and serious) failures than ALL of the motorcycles I've owned in 45 years. Ural loyalists love to make excuses for the brand, but they are just plain junk. Only reason I still have it is that there is no other sidecar motorcycle that is manufactured as such. I do not want a sidecar that is grafted onto a motorcycle (which is not designed to work with a sidecar). Again, a Ural is a good design, but horribly executed. Very poor quality control (or none at all).

Funny to see all the negativity about Harleys. Expensive, yes, but in my experience (I've had five and currently own two), the quality of late model ones is high and once owned, easy and cheap to maintain if you do your own work.

I'd own any of the four Japanese brands, any (older) BMW (obviously), modern Triumphs (I've had old ones and they are beautiful, but no, thanks), and a Ducati (had a Monster 1200 that was truly gorgeous and well-built, but that type of riding just isn't for me; the quality was superb though).

Oh, no Royal Enfields from what I've seen. Cheap. I don't like cheap and I can afford better. Nice looking bikes, though.

My impression of Urals was always that you're basically buying a bike with authentic 1960s engineering. They were soviet copies of the contemporary BMW bikes weren't they? Only they never really changed or advanced over the years. Considering most bikes during that time except for the up and coming japanese brands constantly broke down, that might explain all the mechanical failings.

 

[peterbaron]

>>>>+ 1 <<<<<

 

[Charlie Bravo_imp]

As to the anything from China sentiment, I've seen one of our local multi-brand dealers go heavy on CF Moto. If you visit Delamo Motorsports in Tustin, you have to pass a phalanx of CF Moto bikes to get to Honda, Kawi, Yamaha and everything else. I've looked at them, and have to say that the quality doesn't look bad, but I'm not ready, even though I've got an Indian Enfield and a Malaysian Triumph. Also means that I've seen a growing number of those new CF bikes on the road from that dealer. When I can catch an owner, the first comment is always "Yeah, I know, right? Never thought I'd buy a Chinese bike. But I gotta say for the price, it's pretty nice".

You get the feeling that those owners figure another rider's first comment is going to be about the bike's origin, and having bought one, they're ready to defend it.

I'm fairly certain all Triumphs are built in Thailand now. Never heard of them making any in Malaysia.

Interesting article...

Where was your Triumph motorcycle made?

I spent a summer in Thailand many years ago and those folks LOVE MOTORCYCLES!

Since the average Thai person is physically much smaller than the average Brit or American, they tend to lean towards the smaller displacement bikes, but Triumph has been making serious inroads into Thailand's premium market.

Many of Honda's newer small to midsize models are made in Thailand as well. For example, the CB500. I am not afraid of Thai manufacturing as long as it's manufacturing motorcycles!

Sorry for the brief hijack!

I'm fairly certain all Triumphs are built in Thailand now. Never heard of them making any in Malaysia.

Interesting article...

Where was your Triumph motorcycle made?

I spent a summer in Thailand many years ago and those folks LOVE MOTORCYCLES!

Since the average Thai person is physically much smaller than the average Brit or American, they tend to lean towards the smaller displacement bikes, but Triumph has been making serious inroads into Thailand's premium market.

Many of Honda's newer small to midsize models are made in Thailand as well. For example, the CB500. I am not afraid of Thai manufacturing as long as it's manufacturing motorcycles!

Sorry for the brief hijack!

Wait, you’re right, it is Thailand. I think it was my CB300R that was made in Malaysia. As far as Triumphs, I think the new 400 singles come from India. Really look well put together. A dealer near my weekend gig offered me a test ride next time I swing by. Definitely going to take them up on it.

I'm fairly certain all Triumphs are built in Thailand now. Never heard of them making any in Malaysia.

Interesting article...

Where was your Triumph motorcycle made?

I spent a summer in Thailand many years ago and those folks LOVE MOTORCYCLES!

This is near and dear to me. I started riding in 1969, in Thailand. Stationed on an army Large Tug, based in Sattahip at the Deep Water Port, a bud and I discovered we could rent Honda 350s just up the coast road at Pattaya. The vendor provided a helmet (mandatory for G.I.s) The vendor also told us DO NOT GO TO BANGKOK! We had no desire to go to that crowded bustling city since swe saw a lot of when our tug towed a barge to it. Between the 'Kok and Sattahip, there was a plethora of lightly traveled back roads. I got a speeding ticket in the port from an MP who chased me all the way from the gate to our vessel, about 3 miles. I based my first novel, "The Bangkok Blues" on my time there.





Since the average Thai person is physically much smaller than the average Brit or American, they tend to lean towards the smaller displacement bikes, but Triumph has been making serious inroads into Thailand's premium market.

Many of Honda's newer small to midsize models are made in Thailand as well. For example, the CB500. I am not afraid of Thai manufacturing as long as it's manufacturing motorcycles!

Sorry for the brief hijack!

Wait, you’re right, it is Thailand. I think it was my CB300R that was made in Malaysia. As far as Triumphs, I think the new 400 singles come from India. Really look well put together. A dealer near my weekend gig offered me a test ride next time I swing by. Definitely going to take them up on it.

 

[michael1954]

I know you all like Honda, but I am curious:
IF you had to pay with your own money, and no discounts to the market price - which common brand motorcycle(s) would you never ever buy ?

I would import a Honda 2024 CB1300 Super Four, no other for my first choice to buy, but never to buy.........probably Ducati or Aprilla, and only because I know nothing about how to do maintenance on them, and I do not like the way they look.

 

[emptysea]

I know you all like Honda, but I am curious:
IF you had to pay with your own money, and no discounts to the market price - which common brand motorcycle(s) would you never ever buy ?

Never to any brand that has neither a midsize (1300cc or less) sport tourer nor a bike in the UJM tradition. N.B. A few ADV bikes are effectively sport tourers so those brands would not make my “never” list.

Also, any brand that doesn’t have an authorized dealer in my general proximity.

 

[Charlie Bravo_imp]

KTM - just too many poor reliability stories out there. I know there will be many that say they never had a problem with theirs but there are far too many that do. The motorcycle press seem to turn a blind eye to it too, can't miss out on the latest bike launch in sunny Sardinia! When you see one year old 1290 Super Adventure S's in the dealers you just know why. I've met two 1290 owners here who said never again.

Kick Till Monday
A friend of a riding buddy had a KTM that was fast and handled very well. I was on a ride with some buds and got separated from the group. I was flogging my Yamaha FJR 1300 trying to catch up. Turns out I had taken the wrong fork in the road. They sent the guy with the KTM to find me. He caught me before long, and when he did, he blew by me like a tornado and waved at me to stop.