Electrical Output?

[kenfyoozed_imp]

Well I have been using some heated gear, and wanted to add a coupe of power outlets on the bars to charge phone/gps as well. This is the message I received from the powerlets company......


"There are different types of outlet kits to mount in a lower or rearward
position for plugging in heated gear. However, I'm not sure you are aware
but the 2013 CB1100 does not have a very powerful stator, so it does not
have much excess electical power. The stator output is around 330 watts so
that really only gives you about 50-60 watts to use. The bike will be able
to handle charging a phone, and it may be able to handle one of our heated
jackets on half power 'or' heated gloves, but it will not be able to handle
them all at the same time. Any combination of two of these components will
go past the limit of excess power the bike has. The CB1100 will definitely
not be able to handle most standard heated gear like Gerbings or Firstgear,
which uses anywhere from 75-100 watts of power for their jackets and vests
alone."

So this brings me to ask, what is the power out put of of bikes that is usable? I am worried now that I received this message as I am running , jacket liner, pant liner, gloves, and socks. I would hate to end up stranded due to a dead battery from using all its juice.

 

[dBuster_imp]

Wholy Heated bat gear!

Sorry had to chime in. But that is quite a lot of heated gear! You should be good to go to ride all winter!

That is if the bikes power system can handle it. In regards to that, I thought this issue of power was brought up before. I will search and see if I can find it.

found this, whether it applies or not I cannot tell you:

Maximum power output is 66Kw, with a peak torque figure of 93Nm @ 5,000rpm.

I thought it was a thread talking about adding additional lighting to the bike. Maybe I was on the British 1100 site... ugh the failing memory...

Try this one: [url=http://cb1100forum.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=1521&highlight=watts]Alt/rectifier output

Or better yet this talks about the same issue I believe that you have posted in also: [url=http://cb1100forum.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=1511&page=2&highlight=watts]Winter riding, better than Summer - see page 2 where it talks about the power

 

[kenfyoozed_imp]

In this link 2 diffrent numbers are given for the output 11 and 28 amps.:huh:


Winter riding, better than Summer

A few years ago I bought a heated vest and an adapter wire so I could plug it into my Battery Tender plug-in, which is on all three bikes. That was the best money I'd ever spent on winter riding gear. I used to bundle up to ride in the winter (and still got cold), now it's just a long-sleeve T-shirt, the vest, and my jacket.

Any recommendations for that kind of setup?

Any recommendations for that kind of setup?

Hiker,
I run Gerbing's Jacket, pants, gloves and insert sole's. You have to have an outer windproof shell to keep the heat in. I use a 3 season windproof jacket and ski pants.

I have powerlet outlets on all my bikes but can't find a good spot on the CB so i ran a 15amp fused coax ( comes with the gear when purchased )from the battery to the frame which tucks under the seat. As you can see in the pic it goes to a controller which is a must and then too my jacket. The jacket has outlets to the pants and gloves. You can also buy a coax to sae for battery charging from the same outlet.
Coax Male To SAE Cable - Powerlet Products

Any recommendations for that kind of setup?

Hiker,
I run Gerbing's Jacket, pants, gloves and insert sole's. You have to have an outer windproof shell to keep the heat in. I use a 3 season windproof jacket and ski pants.

I have powerlet outlets on all my bikes but can't find a good spot on the CB so i ran a 15amp fused coax ( comes with the gear when purchased )from the battery to the frame which tucks under the seat. As you can see in the pic it goes to a controller which is a must and then too my jacket. The jacket has outlets to the pants and gloves. You can also buy a coax to sae for battery charging from the same outlet.
Coax Male To SAE Cable - Powerlet Products

CIP... How much draw for all 4 pieces, and does the CB put out enough amps or watts or? To cover them?

Mickey, here you go

Jacket 6.5
Pants 4.0
glove 2.5
Inserts .5

About 13 amps
When i bought these a few years back my ST had no problem handling the draw. I should really look into the watt rating and convert.

Edit: just contacted my dealer who contacted Honda. Bike puts out 11 amps, better ride this mount without the pants.

Mickey, here you go

Jacket 6.5
Pants 4.0
glove 2.5
Inserts .5

About 13 amps
When i bought these a few years back my ST had no problem handling the draw. I should really look into the watt rating and convert.

Edit: just contacted my dealer who contacted Honda. Bike puts out 11 amps, better ride this mount without the pants.
11 amps isn't a lot. When you take out the power for the lights, the ignition and the fuel injection, doesn't seem like there is a lot left. I don't have any idea what those all draw but I'd guess somewhere around 7-8 amps.

Mickey, here you go

Jacket 6.5
Pants 4.0
glove 2.5
Inserts .5

About 13 amps
When i bought these a few years back my ST had no problem handling the draw. I should really look into the watt rating and convert.

Edit: just contacted my dealer who contacted Honda. Bike puts out 11 amps, better ride this mount without the pants.
11 amps isn't a lot. When you take out the power for the lights, the ignition and the fuel injection, doesn't seem like there is a lot left. I don't have any idea what those all draw but I'd guess somewhere around 7-8 amps.
Of course miss informed be the dealer, output is 28amps more than enough to run all the gerbing gear above. You only really run it at about 50% which is about a 7-8 amp draw.

Mickey, here you go

Jacket 6.5
Pants 4.0
glove 2.5
Inserts .5

About 13 amps
When i bought these a few years back my ST had no problem handling the draw. I should really look into the watt rating and convert.

Edit: just contacted my dealer who contacted Honda. Bike puts out 11 amps, better ride this mount without the pants.
11 amps isn't a lot. When you take out the power for the lights, the ignition and the fuel injection, doesn't seem like there is a lot left. I don't have any idea what those all draw but I'd guess somewhere around 7-8 amps.
Of course miss informed be the dealer, output is 28amps more than enough to run all the gerbing gear above. You only really run it at about 50% which is about a 7-8 amp draw.
I have done more searching and I have seen the 11 amp number, but this is the first I have seen the 28 amp figure.

So which is it?

HONDA CB1100 ENGINE (interesting) <---- seems to be speaking of HP in terms of kW not electrical.....though I could be wrong.

these two post by cip57 were made same day, less than 2hrs apart.????????
According too....

Someone check my math.....

Starting with the .336KW/5,000rpm =
.336KW converts to 336 Watts=
336 watts divided by 12v system=
28 amps

So this would be in line with what cip57 found that the generator is INDEED putting out 28 Amps. Which would most likely mean the reserve is 11 amps, the number I have seen most often.

My gear is pulling at max capacity 144w or 12 amps, but since I don't run it at max capacity, as it gets to hot, I "should" be fine. Plus I plan and installing LEDs and I am sure I will gain a few extra Amps/watts back.[/b]

 

[dBuster_imp]

in what you shared there, the only place I see 28 amps is referring to a ST1100 not the CB1100... Unless I missed it somewhere else in what you shared.

Quote: I know the St1100 has 28amp alts and most guys put in 40amp upgrades.
Also in regards to power, my personal thought and belief is to err in the side of caution and safety.

 

[kenfyoozed_imp]

i think i was editing my post while you were responding..... check it now...

Im pretty sure is a 28 Amp output, with 11 Amp reserve.
It's 336 watts. That's 28 amps@12V. Either info or calculations are in error.
You should probably use 14.6v for your calculation which yields 23 amps. Take out the 7-8 amps operating current and that still leaves plenty of amps for accessories. dBuster thanks for those links, i searched but didnt come up with those.
and apologize to others for seeming making another post about items that HAD been discussed prior.:blush:

 

[CIP57_imp]

28 amp output is correct. More than enough to run one or two heated items and a GPS or phone.

 

[Ole]

I will give you all a little real life info but no watts amps etc

I have run my CB1100 with a heated vest on high, and powered my GIVI Nuvi 550 gps on many occasions. The stator has handled it with flying colors. Out of habit, when in towns with a lot of stop lights, I usually toggle the vest off though.
edit
I forgot to add, I have used the Honda heated grips at the same time. But usually leave the grips on medium or low because they get really really hot on high! Too hot for unlined gloves!

 

[kenfyoozed_imp]

Well just received this from Scott at the Powerlet company....


A few things to note, all of the math you're doing is based on 12 volts.
While it is a '12 volt system', 12v voltage regulators are designed to work
at 14.2-14.4 volts, and motorcycle batteries at rest are generally near 13
volts, and shoot up to between 13.3 and 13.8 volts while charging. So the
math of calculating watt/amp usage of electronics must be based on at least
13 if not 13.8 volts (these are the voltages we use in bench testing our
products). So when hooking up your outlets, devices, or garments directly
to the battery the amp usage is calculated off whatever the voltage of the
source is, which is the battery, and battery voltage is generally 13-13.8v.
Another thing to note is that while you are using your heated clothing at
50% power, the controller does not regulate temperature by regulating the
amperage at a solid number. It sends full amperage through the garment but
it blips the power in a wave pattern to control the temperature. So even at
the lowest setting with the jacket and gloves on, it is still blipping the
full 140-150 watts, but only for a fraction of the time it does on higher
settings.

Also, the stated 336 watt output for your stator is the 'peak' output,
which is probably in the area of 4000-5000rpms. So at idle and city riding
it is substantially less than that. So even at peak output while riding,
the bike is putting out 336 watts, but that's at 14.4 volts via the
regulator, not 12, so doing the math total output is 24 amps, not 28. Take
away the 17 amps they say the bike uses and that only leaves you with 7
amps. However you do get to raise the voltage calculation of that 7 amps to
the 13.5 volts that the battery operates at. This gives you about 90 watts
of excess.

However, if Honda is doing their math properly using 13.5 volts from the
battery and they say you still have 11 amps to use, that means that the
bike does not use 17 amps to power itself, but 13. However I find it very
difficult to believe that the CB1100 can power itself using only 150 watts
of power as most carburated bikes use around 185, and a common operating
load for a fuel injected bike is substantially higher at around 250-285
watts.

All I can say is use extreme discretion when using heated clothing with
your bike before you free up some excess electrical capacity. If you have
any other questions please let me know.



Seems I'm back at square one........ and that is , that i will need to dial back on my nice toasty gear until i cut back some power from other areas.

Anyone know if its even possible to get a higher output stator?

 

[the Ferret]

Ken, you are in Alabama aren't you? How much electric gear you need? Does it even get below 60 down there? Lol

 

[kenfyoozed_imp]

Haha yes it gets cold, 27* last friday morning on way to work. But in low 30's on the way home.

 

[the Ferret]

Woo yea, thats cold enough for heated gear. Is that normal? I though Alabama was a hot southern state lol

 

[dBuster_imp]

Ken, you are in Alabama aren't you? How much electric gear you need? Does it even get below 60 down there? Lol

Good point. About Alabama that is... I was still wearing my summer jacket yet and didn't break out the leather jacket until it was in the 50's. But everyone does have their own comfort level...


Couldn't the bike be modded to use an automotive alternator to run auxiliary items? I have seen some older bikes nodded that way. :-D

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4.2.5 - non pro version.

 

[kenfyoozed_imp]

Yeah those temps are normal for us. Last week highs were in 60's with lows in the 30's. This week highs will be in the mid 70;s and lows in the 50's. Temp changes radically, one day freezing weather , two days later your wearing shorts. Ive been camping at the beach over the holidays in december, swimming and getting sunburned during the winter.

 

[CIP57_imp]

Well just received this from Scott at the Powerlet company....


A few things to note, all of the math you're doing is based on 12 volts.
While it is a '12 volt system', 12v voltage regulators are designed to work
at 14.2-14.4 volts, and motorcycle batteries at rest are generally near 13
volts, and shoot up to between 13.3 and 13.8 volts while charging. So the
math of calculating watt/amp usage of electronics must be based on at least
13 if not 13.8 volts (these are the voltages we use in bench testing our
products). So when hooking up your outlets, devices, or garments directly
to the battery the amp usage is calculated off whatever the voltage of the
source is, which is the battery, and battery voltage is generally 13-13.8v.
Another thing to note is that while you are using your heated clothing at
50% power, the controller does not regulate temperature by regulating the
amperage at a solid number. It sends full amperage through the garment but
it blips the power in a wave pattern to control the temperature. So even at
the lowest setting with the jacket and gloves on, it is still blipping the
full 140-150 watts, but only for a fraction of the time it does on higher
settings.

Also, the stated 336 watt output for your stator is the 'peak' output,
which is probably in the area of 4000-5000rpms. So at idle and city riding
it is substantially less than that. So even at peak output while riding,
the bike is putting out 336 watts, but that's at 14.4 volts via the
regulator, not 12, so doing the math total output is 24 amps, not 28. Take
away the 17 amps they say the bike uses and that only leaves you with 7
amps. However you do get to raise the voltage calculation of that 7 amps to
the 13.5 volts that the battery operates at. This gives you about 90 watts
of excess.

However, if Honda is doing their math properly using 13.5 volts from the
battery and they say you still have 11 amps to use, that means that the
bike does not use 17 amps to power itself, but 13. However I find it very
difficult to believe that the CB1100 can power itself using only 150 watts
of power as most carburated bikes use around 185, and a common operating
load for a fuel injected bike is substantially higher at around 250-285
watts.

All I can say is use extreme discretion when using heated clothing with
your bike before you free up some excess electrical capacity. If you have
any other questions please let me know.



Seems I'm back at square one........ and that is , that i will need to dial back on my nice toasty gear until i cut back some power from other areas.

Anyone know if its even possible to get a higher output stator?

Ken,

I'm on the ST1300 site and will try to look up more info. I know the St1100 puts out 28amps same as our bikes, guys have bumped them up to 40 amp with after market equipment.
Edit: Just looked at the St site, the St1300 puts out 740 watts and running usage is about 450 leaving about 300 watts free
Its gets involved to upgrade the alternator on the St1100 as i would presume it would for our bikes.

 

[kenfyoozed_imp]

Ill try to free up some power from all the lights. Front running lights pull roughly 14 watts combined. Front turn signals pull roughly 27watts, as do the rear. Rear brake should be roughly 7 and 27 for run and brake. Switching to low draw leds for the running lights should save at least 12-14 watts, close to one amp. Not sure if its worth the touble, but I plan to change lights anyway so why not...

CIP57, got a link for that ST alternator swap? I doubt it would be the same for the CB but i wouldnt mind reading up on it anyway....

 

[CIP57_imp]

Ill try to free up some power from all the lights. Front running lights pull roughly 14 watts combined. Front turn signals pull roughly 27watts, as do the rear. Rear brake should be roughly 7 and 27 for run and brake. Switching to low draw leds for the running lights should save at least 12-14 watts, close to one amp. Not sure if its worth the touble, but I plan to change lights anyway so why not...

CIP57, got a link for that ST alternator swap? I doubt it would be the same for the CB but i wouldnt mind reading up on it anyway....

Ken,
Read through these posts. Should give you an idea of whats involved. Not sure if you need to be a member but give it a try.
ST1100-Alternator

 

[kenfyoozed_imp]

Thanks, Looked over a few and it seems they are pulling a higher ouput stator from a newer model. Maybe the '14 will have a higher output? Doubt it but i'm off to go check....if thats even possible....
seems the EX puts out the same power...........back to square one
ppossible stator rewind?

 

[cb400four_imp]

Thanks, Looked over a few and it seems they are pulling a higher ouput stator from a newer model. Maybe the '14 will have a higher output? Doubt it but i'm off to go check....if thats even possible....
seems the EX puts out the same power...........back to square one
ppossible stator rewind?

kenfyoozed, I notice that you also posted regarding a HID conversion kit; my understanding is that HID draws more power than stock H4 and much more than aftermarket LED for the same lumens. You might be able to run more heated gear by incorporating efficiency in your lighting choices.

I'm also looking into electrical power capacity on the CB1100 and if I find objective information I'll pass it on to you.

 

[kenfyoozed_imp]

Any help would be appreciated. Yes i think switching to LED headlight, and LED for all the other lights as well should free up at least a few amps.

If I can remember I may call a company in Birmingham, AL who rewinds stators. They suposedly have been able to squeeze more power out of stock stators. Not sure if its worth it. There was a thread I read somewhere, some other forum that it also created more heat, which I dont think would be good for our engines.

 

[Gingersdaddy_imp]

I wonder how many amps the heated grips draw on the system? I do not have the heated grips and wanted to get glove liners and vest. Been looking at Venture 12V heated gear, anybody else using Venture gear?