the Ferret
Road warrior
That would be very fortunate if that's all it was. Keep us informed
CB1100 Idle speed instability problem
- Thread starter ericlo69_imp
- Start date
Fingers crossed zirconxi.
dsan1964, I've moved your question from this thread and started a new one here.
Good to hear from you.
Good to hear from you.
Johnnb_imp
New to the forum
It's a disgrace that these CB1100's even have these problems with idle speed instability.
All these problems should have been sorted by Honda before the bike ever came to the market.
I am amazed on this forum to see how many CB1100's have this problem.
I thought the PGMF1 Injection system was one of the best in the world.
Obviously not !!!
My 2014 CB1100EX has developed this problem and this is on a bike that cost me over 10 grand !!!
It's not acceptable
PERIOD
I was there when the CB750 made its debut on the motorcycling world. In a 10 year production run I never heard of any major issues with electrics or engine issues. They just fired up and went which is the reason anyone buys a motorcycle. I have seen some very high mileage CB750 bikes and always only the highest praise from their owners
My new 2014 CB1100EX has only done 12,000 dry miles and has had lots of issues.
Progress. I don't think so !!!
I thought the idea of buying a new motorcycle was to get out there to ride and blow away your troubles, not to be constantly on a forum trying to work out issues that frankly shouldn't excist on such an expensive motorcycle.
Honda
I'm not interested in sorting out your fuel injection idle tickover problems or any other of the issues on these bikes that you seem to think are acceptable.
THEY ARE NOT !!!.
I bought the bike to have thousands of trouble free miles and ride off into the sunset.
HONDA YOU NEED TO GET YOUR ACT TOGETHER BECAUSE SOME OF YOUR PRODUCTS ARE OVER PRICED AND NOT FIT FOR PURPOSE.
ON TOP OF THAT YOUR ATTITUDE TO THE CUSTOMER ONCE THE MOTORCYCLE HAS BEEN PURCHASED
IS ON A SCALE OF 1 to 10.
ZERO
All these problems should have been sorted by Honda before the bike ever came to the market.
I am amazed on this forum to see how many CB1100's have this problem.
I thought the PGMF1 Injection system was one of the best in the world.
Obviously not !!!
My 2014 CB1100EX has developed this problem and this is on a bike that cost me over 10 grand !!!
It's not acceptable
PERIOD
I was there when the CB750 made its debut on the motorcycling world. In a 10 year production run I never heard of any major issues with electrics or engine issues. They just fired up and went which is the reason anyone buys a motorcycle. I have seen some very high mileage CB750 bikes and always only the highest praise from their owners
My new 2014 CB1100EX has only done 12,000 dry miles and has had lots of issues.
Progress. I don't think so !!!
I thought the idea of buying a new motorcycle was to get out there to ride and blow away your troubles, not to be constantly on a forum trying to work out issues that frankly shouldn't excist on such an expensive motorcycle.
Honda
I'm not interested in sorting out your fuel injection idle tickover problems or any other of the issues on these bikes that you seem to think are acceptable.
THEY ARE NOT !!!.
I bought the bike to have thousands of trouble free miles and ride off into the sunset.
HONDA YOU NEED TO GET YOUR ACT TOGETHER BECAUSE SOME OF YOUR PRODUCTS ARE OVER PRICED AND NOT FIT FOR PURPOSE.
ON TOP OF THAT YOUR ATTITUDE TO THE CUSTOMER ONCE THE MOTORCYCLE HAS BEEN PURCHASED
IS ON A SCALE OF 1 to 10.
ZERO
max
Road warrior
Well John, we're not the complaints department here, we try to help each other if we can:blush:
Lord Popgun
Road warrior
I gotta go with Max on this.
the Ferret
Road warrior
No manufacturer ....car, motorcycle, boat or airplane makes a perfect product. Regardless of price. Look at the Boeing 737 Max airplane that costs 106 million dollars. If they make 10,000 of a product, a certain percentage of that number will have issues. Some significant issues. Nobody that ends up with one of these defective products is happy, naturally, and generally few are pleased with how the dealer/manufacturer responds to their complaints.
We have over 5000 registered members from something like 23 countries. The number of reported problems gave been very few, but there have been some. I doubt if it's been more than 1 or 2 percent, but no one, not even Honda can make every single motorcycle they make perfect. Wish they could, but it's physically impossible.
If you get a bad one and Honda won't or cant make it right, it only makes sense to get rid of it and get something else. I did that after 3 years of trouble with a Chevy Truck that cost as much as 3 1/2 CB 1100's. All you can do is move on.
We have over 5000 registered members from something like 23 countries. The number of reported problems gave been very few, but there have been some. I doubt if it's been more than 1 or 2 percent, but no one, not even Honda can make every single motorcycle they make perfect. Wish they could, but it's physically impossible.
If you get a bad one and Honda won't or cant make it right, it only makes sense to get rid of it and get something else. I did that after 3 years of trouble with a Chevy Truck that cost as much as 3 1/2 CB 1100's. All you can do is move on.
Johnnb_imp
New to the forum
I have all the same problems with my 2014 CB1100EXRiko_imp said:
The whole experience of this bike I bought from new has been disastrous.
Too many issues. Not worth the money and not enjoyable to ride anymore.
This bike is a total FLOP
Houtman_imp
Road warrior
Johnnb , I feel really bad for you that you have had all the problems with your bike. It is not to say that all CB 1100's are a flop but your bike certainly is .
One thing to think about : how many spouses are a flop and it is far more expensive to get rid of them than to get rid of a bike !!!
One thing to think about : how many spouses are a flop and it is far more expensive to get rid of them than to get rid of a bike !!!
According to "da'Net", about 43% of first marriages end in divorce, so Honda appears to be doing pretty good in comparison.Houtman_imp said:
John, I preface the following with a simple statement: I sincerely hope your next bike works out better for you, really I do.Johnnb_imp said:
But, while I think you will receive a sympathetic ear regarding your issues, what's your motivation for telling us several times how awful your bike is here on this forum? If it is still to vent, then by all means, I guess. It truly is unfortunate that yours turned out to be bad. If you are looking for advice...
1. Have you taken up your issues directly with Honda Customer Service, not dealership, but C.S. ? If so, and you received no response, or a "sorry" but "no action" from them, then you've likely done what you can, unless you want to invest time/money into what, "legal action", class action law-suite?
My low/idle experience: I did contact C.S. I typed a 2 page letter explaining what others had been through, I referenced this site, copied several statements that seemed to pinpoint the issue, and I specifically asked them to explain what they would do about it. Within maybe 2 months they emailed me back and we set up a phone call. They listened. Then they outlined their case: I needed to go through my dealership, have them diagnose the issue. The dealership warned me that because my idle issues were intermittent, they wouldn't limit diagnostic charge to one hour because they had to spend time with bike until it acted up. Arg! Back to C.S. They stood by their statement that they wanted to know what it was first, then MAYBE they would help out (note: looking back at it, this is where I should have been more adament that C.S. should have contacted dealership and charged me only for 1 hour diagnostic fee).
The bike was 6 months out of warranty. At the time, it seemed others were having difficulty diagnosing the issue, but it seemed likely the fault was a bad IACV. One member at the time said his was repaired under warranty and the fix (parts / labor) was in the neighborhood of 3 grand. That scared me away. My bike needed new tires, needed valve check, I had only paid 7k for it new, and so while looking at a Triumph, I found the dealership was going to give me nearly 5 grand for trade in...I got 2 years out of the bike and 10miles, so instead of doing tires, valve check and getting idle issue fixed, not knowing if I would have to pay all or part of a possibly expensive fix...I took the trade in. But I write all the above to give you, others, an idea of what happens with C.S....maybe to learn from it.
I sure wish my '14 standard had worked out, I loved the bike. But I moved on.
2. If you've exhausted all that you're able / willing to do, then I would say it is time to do just that--move on from your CB1100.
I can't tell you how frustrated I was when my '14 started with the idle issues. It just seemed so "unfair"...everybody had always told me how reliable Honda bikes were. I bought the darned thing because of the positive reputation of Honda. I spent all that money! Arg. Now when people tell me "you'll never have issues with ____ , it's rock-solid"...my answer is: "you won't have any issues--until you do".
I truly hope this is the only "lemon" experience you have with motorcycles. Those Triumphs are pretty sweet looking / sounding machines. Good luck with your next purchase.
peterbaron
Road warrior
IMHO the best in fixing problems is, if I count on myself. One diagnose, one repair, one fix, ONE person responsibility... and NO-one complaints. Period.
Worked 4 decades for car dealerships (same make)...50% mechanics are butchers/parts replacers, a few techs are OK, generally, each dealer has one good, honest and profesional hi-tech trouble-shooter.
If you have a good car and bad mechanic = he will ruin your car...you dont even know how bad diags I've seen, horrors....multi ATM +++ replacement (one car) for misdiagnosed/loose ground bolt..
...and the butchers get the best/easy jobs, and you cannot get rid of them :huh:
If you have a problem vehicle and good tech = he will fix it for you.
My advice: find good tech and stick with him/establish good relation as long as you can..., he will tell you what you need first, what last, and what is not needed at all, no substitute..
Needless to say, this forum is fortunate by having good techs/people
Good luck to all.
Worked 4 decades for car dealerships (same make)...50% mechanics are butchers/parts replacers, a few techs are OK, generally, each dealer has one good, honest and profesional hi-tech trouble-shooter.
If you have a good car and bad mechanic = he will ruin your car...you dont even know how bad diags I've seen, horrors....multi ATM +++ replacement (one car) for misdiagnosed/loose ground bolt..
...and the butchers get the best/easy jobs, and you cannot get rid of them :huh:If you have a problem vehicle and good tech = he will fix it for you.
My advice: find good tech and stick with him/establish good relation as long as you can..., he will tell you what you need first, what last, and what is not needed at all, no substitute..
Needless to say, this forum is fortunate by having good techs/people
Good luck to all.
SportsterDoc
Road warrior
For the record, so that a rant does not overlay the diagnosis and solutions posted on this thread, post 1159 is one of the summaries and the issue is NOT the fuel injection system, it is the idle air control valve with only a couple exceptions, such as a damaged TPS wire.
It is most unfortunate that there have been issues, no matter how small a percentage, but through joint efforts on this forum, the major cause has been identified.
I put over 12,500 miles on my 2014 standard, in 10 months, with ZERO issues.
It is most unfortunate that there have been issues, no matter how small a percentage, but through joint efforts on this forum, the major cause has been identified.
I put over 12,500 miles on my 2014 standard, in 10 months, with ZERO issues.
I’m not sure Popgun. I just tried to load the spreadsheet and it told me my permissions had been changed and I could not access the document. That’s likely to mean that whoever created it—Max, maybe—needs to update the permissions and post a new link.Cormanus_imp said:
Hi guys,
Sorry it's been awhile since I dropped by. Can you access the spreadsheet now?
CB1100 idle issues
EDIT: After some detective work, someone else took ownership (anonymous leopard) of the original spreadsheet link here:
CB1100 Idle Speed Instability—Link to Spreadsheet
max
Road warrior
Thanks curlyjoe, i have downloaded it in 3 different formats just to be sure to be sure. good job.
syncronizator_imp
Running like a top
My Idle problem seems to be solved until now.
I have traveled 12000km since replacing the IACV.
The problem never recurred.
I have traveled 12000km since replacing the IACV.
The problem never recurred.
Good news, synchronizator.
max
Road warrior
Thanks sync, that's great news, thank you for all the effort you put into this thread and this feedback, all the best to you.
SportsterDoc
Road warrior
Glad to see multiple confirmations of the team testing that was done two and a half years ago reference post 775:
http://cb1100forum.com/forum/showthread....20&page=78
http://cb1100forum.com/forum/showthread....20&page=78
iamheero_imp
Running like a top
Hello all,
It's with a heavy heart I write this comment but I'm at my wit's end trying to tackle this solo so far! I believe my 2017 has been afflicted by this nasty IACV issue and it's a real bummer, but it's taken a long time to diagnose because of how intermittent it is. I had put about 22,000 miles on the bike before I had the valves adjusted (not that I noticed any issues, but I felt like it was overdue). While I had that done, I also got my bike professionally tuned by a local shop with a good reputation. Although it rode fine for a while after, things have gotten progressively worse and I think I'm going to have to take the bike in soon.
First, I had very intermittently had issues with high idle as I started the bike (~1800rpm) until it was warmed up, and those were solved with a kill-switch reset. I paid it no mind, really, since it happened like 3 times over the year I was riding it and solved itself generally.
Then I started noticing it would stay above ~1100 rpm even after it should have warmed up and this happened frequently.
THEN I noticed that the RPM would drop to 5-600rpm at idle, rolling up to stop signs and in traffic, and unless I rolled on the throttle immediately, it would die. It would start right up on me, but would die at the next stop sign.
At this point, I tried to remedy the issue myself. I changed the oil and filter early (usually at 5,000mi), spark plugs, cleaned the air filter, cleaned the TPS sensor and checked for kinks, reset the TPS, and while I was at it changed the brake and clutch fluids and replaced the chain and sprockets. I also tried to give it the ol' Italian tune-up, riding with very high RPMs and redlining it for a bit. I tried to seafoam the oil and gas and emptied and refilled the gas tank as well. I tried a tank of 93 instead of the usual regular I use. I would test after each of those fixes and was still having trouble, but eventually it just sorta stopped happening.
The idle at start was high, 14-1500 until warm, but after about 10 minutes of riding it would settle at around 9500 and was *fairly* stable. Less stable than I was used to before all this, and not reading where it should, but it got me around town and felt great when I was in motion. And for about 1000 miles it didn't die on me again, but the weather was getting cooler too at this point and I hear ambient temperature could affect the IACV issues.
So yesterday it was a warm LA day and I went for a ride, it died on me a few times in traffic. Same 600rpm to stall pattern as before.
So the question I have is this: does this sound like IACV troubles? Anything else I can do? Money isn't exactly flowing like water with COVID so if I could avoid giving a shop several thousand dollars to fix a highly intermittent and difficult-to-diagnose problem that'd be great.
It's with a heavy heart I write this comment but I'm at my wit's end trying to tackle this solo so far! I believe my 2017 has been afflicted by this nasty IACV issue and it's a real bummer, but it's taken a long time to diagnose because of how intermittent it is. I had put about 22,000 miles on the bike before I had the valves adjusted (not that I noticed any issues, but I felt like it was overdue). While I had that done, I also got my bike professionally tuned by a local shop with a good reputation. Although it rode fine for a while after, things have gotten progressively worse and I think I'm going to have to take the bike in soon.
First, I had very intermittently had issues with high idle as I started the bike (~1800rpm) until it was warmed up, and those were solved with a kill-switch reset. I paid it no mind, really, since it happened like 3 times over the year I was riding it and solved itself generally.
Then I started noticing it would stay above ~1100 rpm even after it should have warmed up and this happened frequently.
THEN I noticed that the RPM would drop to 5-600rpm at idle, rolling up to stop signs and in traffic, and unless I rolled on the throttle immediately, it would die. It would start right up on me, but would die at the next stop sign.
At this point, I tried to remedy the issue myself. I changed the oil and filter early (usually at 5,000mi), spark plugs, cleaned the air filter, cleaned the TPS sensor and checked for kinks, reset the TPS, and while I was at it changed the brake and clutch fluids and replaced the chain and sprockets. I also tried to give it the ol' Italian tune-up, riding with very high RPMs and redlining it for a bit. I tried to seafoam the oil and gas and emptied and refilled the gas tank as well. I tried a tank of 93 instead of the usual regular I use. I would test after each of those fixes and was still having trouble, but eventually it just sorta stopped happening.
The idle at start was high, 14-1500 until warm, but after about 10 minutes of riding it would settle at around 9500 and was *fairly* stable. Less stable than I was used to before all this, and not reading where it should, but it got me around town and felt great when I was in motion. And for about 1000 miles it didn't die on me again, but the weather was getting cooler too at this point and I hear ambient temperature could affect the IACV issues.
So yesterday it was a warm LA day and I went for a ride, it died on me a few times in traffic. Same 600rpm to stall pattern as before.
So the question I have is this: does this sound like IACV troubles? Anything else I can do? Money isn't exactly flowing like water with COVID so if I could avoid giving a shop several thousand dollars to fix a highly intermittent and difficult-to-diagnose problem that'd be great.
max
Road warrior
Iamheero thanks for your very detailed response, you are the very first one with a 2017 model with this issue, i find it interesting that the bike was "serviced" shortly before these things happened.
As a first response i would have a very careful talk with the actual tech who did the service and without letting him know you have this problem try to find out what exactly he touched or worked on.
I agree that the symptoms are similar but cannot help thinking something happened during the service and i am glad you mentioned it.
As the group discovered various sensors have an effect on the iacv response, the engine temp sensor for instance can put it way off and does not set a mil code from memory if disconnected.
My first response would be a connector that is not seating properly or a pinched wire but that is just a guess and just for kicks have you had a close look if any vacuum hoses are loose/missing/damaged/ not in the right place etc?.
And as an interim measure you could disconnect the iacv when it idles correctly warmed up, it won't set any codes and is very likely to stay in that position, just unsure of how it idles when cold but you can always open the throttle manually on startup, my honda 900 hornet only has a manual adjustment screw and it always starts fine with just a little help from the throttle handle.
All the iacv does is pass air through the throttle bodies for the engine to startup and idle which is the same as the old fashioned idle adjustment screw on a set of carbs, the temp sensor will do the correct fueling for the engine at all times.
I also hope other members who have had iacv issues will check in and verify your diagnosis and/or ask for some more details before advising something.
This fault is very difficult to pinpoint for a tech unless he had a lot of experience with these cases and you could be led in the wrong direction by someone with less experience.
Bflint is in the San Diego area and has access to the diagnostic device to check iacv steps and other sensors, that may be useful at some stage.
So at this at this stage just gather some evidence and possibly we can find an answer if we put our minds together for you
As a first response i would have a very careful talk with the actual tech who did the service and without letting him know you have this problem try to find out what exactly he touched or worked on.
I agree that the symptoms are similar but cannot help thinking something happened during the service and i am glad you mentioned it.
As the group discovered various sensors have an effect on the iacv response, the engine temp sensor for instance can put it way off and does not set a mil code from memory if disconnected.
My first response would be a connector that is not seating properly or a pinched wire but that is just a guess and just for kicks have you had a close look if any vacuum hoses are loose/missing/damaged/ not in the right place etc?.
And as an interim measure you could disconnect the iacv when it idles correctly warmed up, it won't set any codes and is very likely to stay in that position, just unsure of how it idles when cold but you can always open the throttle manually on startup, my honda 900 hornet only has a manual adjustment screw and it always starts fine with just a little help from the throttle handle.
All the iacv does is pass air through the throttle bodies for the engine to startup and idle which is the same as the old fashioned idle adjustment screw on a set of carbs, the temp sensor will do the correct fueling for the engine at all times.
I also hope other members who have had iacv issues will check in and verify your diagnosis and/or ask for some more details before advising something.
This fault is very difficult to pinpoint for a tech unless he had a lot of experience with these cases and you could be led in the wrong direction by someone with less experience.
Bflint is in the San Diego area and has access to the diagnostic device to check iacv steps and other sensors, that may be useful at some stage.
So at this at this stage just gather some evidence and possibly we can find an answer if we put our minds together for you
Similar threads
