Another Harley Thread

[Cormanus]

I've no interest in the 'Harley haters'. Harleys are not my thing, but they're fine motorcycles and lots and lots and lots of people have drunk the cool aid and love them. Good for them.

I do, however, find the occasional conversation about whether or not we are seeing demise of this self-appointed American icon most interesting.

From ADVRider, this thread and opinion from RyanF9.

 

[the Ferret]

I've seen the vid. Harley is indeed in trouble, but they are only a symptom of the trouble the industry at large is in. New riders are not coming up in enough numbers to support a vibrant motorcycle industry here in the states. The Japanese have been smart enough to get a foothold in places like Asia and China with lots of small great motorcycles, so they will be ok, but Harley hasn't and will be in big trouble in the long run. Harley may become a boutique brand. There will always be motorcycles and I believe there will always be new Harley Davidson's

 

[LongRanger_imp]

I don’t know. Cadillac and Buick reinvented themselves quite successfully to a younger demographic. Can HD follow suit?

 

[rboe]

With JC Penny's, Sears, and other big names going by the wayside, I'm not that confident HD will be around forever.

I think what may happen to them is that someone will buy them and they will become a niche brand like Moto Guzzi. With stricter and stricter regulations on emissions, HD as we know it will be gone. Gas engines are becoming an endangered power plant.

Now for a long time some transportation vehicles will still use gas but if your car doesn't, then it becomes very hard to justify all your neighborhood gas stations which will make getting gas for our toys; if not harder, certainly more expensive. At that point a lot of folks will simply find something else.

Won't affect us much. We'll be dead or confined to quarters.

 

[Cormanus]

None of us really knows whether Harley will survive and, if so, in what form. Ryan argues it's starting a long way from where it could have by missing a major opportunity to change when Reagan protected it.

 

[the Ferret]

I just read a report on Foxnews business that said according to the new CEO all new models are off the table and that dealers will only be recieving limited numbers of Harleys most popular models for the foreseeable future

 

[LongRanger_imp]

No Livewire, no Pan Am, no Bronx?

 

[the Ferret]

Apparently. I tried copying the url but I'm on my tablet and had no success. I found it on Google news

 

[Cormanus]

This one? Harley-Davidson plans for fewer models, simpler factories after coronavirus shutdown

 

[zirconxi_imp]

Well, it will be sad to see HD go. But any motorcycle brand that only cater to higher end of the scale are having a tough time surviving. Even BMW see that, hence their launching of 310 models to cater for the lower range of the market. I don't like HD, but legends are still legends. Dipping their toes in the lower end market might not work for their brand. But i don't understand why they don't want to do it like what Toyota and Honda did, like Toyota with their Lexus, Honda with their Acura. Maybe HD with a sister brand for the lower end market for Asia.

 

[noroomtomove]

@ 4:45.

 

[the Ferret]

This one? Harley-Davidson plans for fewer models, simpler factories after coronavirus shutdown

That's it Cormanus

 

[Gone in 60]

Man, Ryan sure did stir the pot with that Harley video. I've seen it referenced on a number of motorcycle forums, sparking a lot of conversation. I have no interest in buying a Harley, or, for the most part, interacting with Harley people, so his video was an interesting look at a brand I haven't paid much attention to.

But, when HD showed signs of branching out with an adventure bike and a non-cruiser standard, I had a glimmer of interest. In many of the conversations about the recent video and news, references like Ferret's, that the new CEO has nixed the new upcoming models to concentrate on what they've always built makes me lose interest again.

I don't mind Harleys, and appreciate anyone who enjoys motorcycles as much as I do. But, I get little reminders about the Harley attitude. There's a large motorcycle parking area in my city's center plaza. I parked my Bonneville in the middle of the empty lot recently to grab a cup of coffee. When I came back, there was one other bike in the lot - a big Harley bagger, who felt the need to park so close to my Triumph that I needed to roll it out of the way to get on it. I got the message... "This is Harley country, son." I checked my bike for heel marks.

 

[redbirds_imp]

Never owned a Harley nor have any intention to ever own one but there is no denying that they are well made. I do wish them well and that they find a formula that will ensure their survival.

Man, Ryan sure did stir the pot with that Harley video. I've seen it referenced on a number of motorcycle forums, sparking a lot of conversation. I have no interest in buying a Harley, or, for the most part, interacting with Harley people, so his video was an interesting look at a brand I haven't paid much attention to.

But, when HD showed signs of branching out with an adventure bike and a non-cruiser standard, I had a glimmer of interest. In many of the conversations about the recent video and news, references like Ferret's, that the new CEO has nixed the new upcoming models to concentrate on what they've always built makes me lose interest again.

I don't mind Harleys, and appreciate anyone who enjoys motorcycles as much as I do. But, I get little reminders about the Harley attitude. There's a large motorcycle parking area in my city's center plaza. I parked my Bonneville in the middle of the empty lot recently to grab a cup of coffee. When I came back, there was one other bike in the lot - a big Harley bagger, who felt the need to park so close to my Triumph that I needed to roll it out of the way to get on it. I got the message... "This is Harley country, son." I checked my bike for heel marks.

That attitude by an unprincipled Harley rider is one reason they are in trouble. Many, me included, are put off by an air of superiority among some HD riders.

 

[pdedse]

I bought a 2004 Sportster 1200 new...it was the mc that got me back on a bike after a looooong absence. Just a great machine, one wiring issue that affected the speedometer for a spell, but rock solid overall. The salespeople at the dealership never failed to to ask when I was going to "upgrade" when I would go in for oil/filters.

The first time they asked me I replied with "why, is there something wrong with the HD oil and filters?". Guy's reaction was one of those "ah-ha" moments for me.

The Sportser was the only HD model I was ever interested in. Loved that bike!

 

[Frulk_imp]

Lots of folks forget that just because you buy a particular brand doesn’t mean you have to hang with that ownership group. I own 2 Harley’s. For years now on weekends a large local HD group meets at a service station close to my house. They go on rides throughout the area that are posted on a schedule and anyone is welcome to go with. I have never gone. Not my thing to ride in groups. I wouldn’t show up if 25 CB’s were there. I like all motorcycles in general. I can’t say that about their riders.

 

[Wisedrum]

Lots of folks forget that just because you buy a particular brand doesn’t mean you have to hang with that ownership group. I own 2 Harley’s. For years now on weekends a large local HD group meets at a service station close to my house. They go on rides throughout the area that are posted on a schedule and anyone is welcome to go with. I have never gone. Not my thing to ride in groups. I wouldn’t show up if 25 CB’s were there. I like all motorcycles in general. I can’t say that about their riders.

Same with me. I prefer to ride alone. Don't like the way a group dynamic among riders can develope. Don't like to a lead group or have to follow other riders. Boring.

Seldom meet other riders in groups at a parking place or a rest that are not somehow strange and so much involved in their "game" not opening nicely up to strangers. Just recently met some guys that had to wait for a ferry too. I try to start a conversation after greeting them and immediately recognized that it was a fault. Their interest was zero showing no warm and heartful interest. Doing the same thing like riding a motorbike doesn't automatically mean to be on the same wave length or share a common sense for being open minded. Often the opposite is true as I found out. Sometimes, if you meet a single rider, you can make a total different, which means more friendly experience. HD-riders alone or in groups are mostly not among these riders here.

Wisedrum

 

[Gone in 60]

It's interesting to watch how different brands have had to react to competitors encroaching on their turf. In the '70s and '80s, American cars were, let's face it, crap. Honda and Toyota were eating their lunch, and GM, Ford and Chrysler had to improve to survive.

More recently, I'd argue that Honda and Toyota had become complacent. The cars were reliable, but had become very lackluster. The 2011/2012 Civic was not recommended by Consumer Reports for the first time in its history, and Honda executives actually apologized for having built a sub-par car. Having rented Corollas of the same vintage, I was surprised at how noisy and rough they felt. Meanwhile, KIA and Hyundai were upping their game from Korea, and started eating into Honda and Toyota's market. Now they were in the same position the American brands had previously been. The Japanese brands had to get better.

HD is in the position to expand their offerings, and they've shown prototypes of what those might be. But, if they get axed, as others have said, where does HD have to go but into a niche brand position, for the dwindling number of riders who can afford a luxury cruiser with a large price tag, or the guys who are happy shelling out for one of their smaller models.

 

[Gone in 60]

Yeah, our 2010 CRV will probably go another 200,000 miles.
But it looks like it was designed by someone who was taking a nap at the time.

 

[RLS_imp]

I am looking to pickup a cruiser/touring bike to ride from Memphis to Denver than over to Scottsdale and back. I would love to do it on the CB, but I think it would wear me out. That said, I went and test rode some Harley's; a 2015 Dyna Low Rider, 2017 Heritage Soft tail and a 2018 Road King. All had about 4k to 6k miles and priced from $12k to $15k. I had a blast riding each of these bikes. Love the big 103 and 107 engines. However, when I get back on the CB to ride home, I am so glad I own this bike. It is superior in every way. I won't be getting a Harley, but I am interested in what bike would be a good stablemate for the CB, one that is better suited for touring. Any opinions would be appreciated.