2014 vs. 2013 Gear Ratios (Especially 6th)

[calamarichris_imp]

Thanks Guthy!
Would like to have seen a little more of a jump than that, but we'll see.

 

[Deanohh_imp]

This is a little rough cause I don't quite get the primary ratio.

the 13 5th gear is 30/29= 1.0345 which is taller than the 14 5th gear (1.074) and tha 13 has a taller sprocket ratio.

at 70mph in 5th, the 14 turns about 200+ rpm more than the 13.

at 70, the 14 in 6th turns about 200 rpm less than the 13 in 5th.

Unless I'm wrong, which is entirely possible.

 

[Dakota_imp]

This is a little rough cause I don't quite get the primary ratio.

the 13 5th gear is 30/29= 1.0345 which is taller than the 14 5th gear (1.074) and tha 13 has a taller sprocket ratio.

at 70mph in 5th, the 14 turns about 200+ rpm more than the 13.

at 70, the 14 in 6th turns about 200 rpm less than the 13 in 5th.

Unless I'm wrong, which is entirely possible.

200 rpm? Hardly seems worth the effort. I don't feel bad at all having a 5 speed.

 

[davidsargee_imp]

Can't believe Honda hasn't released a brochure or anything anywhere on the web with the 6th gear ratio by now.
I rented a BMW R1150R once and that was a real overdrive--I'm doing 75 with the rest of San Diego traffic with the engine ticking along barely awake at a little over 3000rpm.

One of the least intelligent metrics US motorcycle magazines focus on is the top-gear roll-on. The mfr's think that's what we all want, but I want a real overdrive. Downshifting to 5th (or 4th) for a little extra squirt when needed ain't that much trouble.

And if the CB edges out the Bonneville, I'll most likely be changing the rear sprock back to a 39. (Heck, OldF7's right; one tooth on the rear ain't even enough to notice, maybe even a 38. If the ol girl's speed sensor is located at the drive shaft, that might even be enough to trick it into 120mph.)

True enough, but I sure appreciated that roll-on when the nice person in the Tahoe entered the freeway and crossed three lanes in an apparent effort to bank me off of the concrete divider. A car was behind me, I had nowhere to go but straight ahead.

 

[the Ferret]

I agree with Dakota, if Deanohh is right 200 rpm seems hardly worth the effort, although it will be a 400 rpm swing from 5 th to 6 th at the same speed on the 2014 which if you remember is what I predicted...the equivalent of +1 front or -3 rear on the 2013.

 

[calamarichris_imp]

Can't believe Honda hasn't released a brochure or anything anywhere on the web with the 6th gear ratio by now.
I rented a BMW R1150R once and that was a real overdrive--I'm doing 75 with the rest of San Diego traffic with the engine ticking along barely awake at a little over 3000rpm.

One of the least intelligent metrics US motorcycle magazines focus on is the top-gear roll-on. The mfr's think that's what we all want, but I want a real overdrive. Downshifting to 5th (or 4th) for a little extra squirt when needed ain't that much trouble.

And if the CB edges out the Bonneville, I'll most likely be changing the rear sprock back to a 39. (Heck, OldF7's right; one tooth on the rear ain't even enough to notice, maybe even a 38. If the ol girl's speed sensor is located at the drive shaft, that might even be enough to trick it into 120mph.)

True enough, but I sure appreciated that roll-on when the nice person in the Tahoe entered the freeway and crossed three lanes in an apparent effort to bank me off of the concrete divider. A car was behind me, I had nowhere to go but straight ahead.

You're getting lazy if you expect top gear roll-on to save you from a Tahoe-assault. Gosh-heck, I instinctively downshift and cover the brakes whenever my spidey-sense tells me there's a Tahoe-ho driving within a 500-yard radius.
A good rule-of-thumb is "An infantryman never turns his back on a tank."

If Tahoes are the Panzers, Escalades are the Tiger-tanks. I think I saw an Escalade driver not texting once, but only because she was too busy going after a booger while rooting around on the floor for her cellphone and putting another SpongeBob DVD in the player for her stupid kids.
Boycott Mitsubishi IMO. (Click.)

 

[davidsargee_imp]

Not lazy, at 70-75 mph in 5th gear, the CB1100 is turning 4000 rpm or a little better, this is right where the sweet spot starts. I don't know if you have ridden a CB1100, if not, it's a lot like the old Kawi Z-1, but a little stronger, (and much smoother). In a roll on at that speed the bike just goes,....hard....., this may be my favorite attribute of the bike.

I will down-shift in a heartbeat if I think I need to, that habit is still deeply ingrained in my DNA from my days with the Kawi H-2. In the situation I was referring to, braking was not an option, there was a Land Rover behind me that was also pretending I wasn't there. I could have down-shifted, true, but the roll on performance of the CB at that speed is more than adequate to get you out of Dodge in a hurry. I saw the Tahoe coming, accelerated, and watched the rest in the rear view. Had I not been alert to it, it could have been different.

 

[davidsargee_imp]

Can't believe Honda hasn't released a brochure or anything anywhere on the web with the 6th gear ratio by now.
I rented a BMW R1150R once and that was a real overdrive--I'm doing 75 with the rest of San Diego traffic with the engine ticking along barely awake at a little over 3000rpm.

One of the least intelligent metrics US motorcycle magazines focus on is the top-gear roll-on. The mfr's think that's what we all want, but I want a real overdrive. Downshifting to 5th (or 4th) for a little extra squirt when needed ain't that much trouble.

And if the CB edges out the Bonneville, I'll most likely be changing the rear sprock back to a 39. (Heck, OldF7's right; one tooth on the rear ain't even enough to notice, maybe even a 38. If the ol girl's speed sensor is located at the drive shaft, that might even be enough to trick it into 120mph.)

True enough, but I sure appreciated that roll-on when the nice person in the Tahoe entered the freeway and crossed three lanes in an apparent effort to bank me off of the concrete divider. A car was behind me, I had nowhere to go but straight ahead.

You're getting lazy if you expect top gear roll-on to save you from a Tahoe-assault. Gosh-heck, I instinctively downshift and cover the brakes whenever my spidey-sense tells me there's a Tahoe-ho driving within a 500-yard radius.
A good rule-of-thumb is "An infantryman never turns his back on a tank."

If Tahoes are the Panzers, Escalades are the Tiger-tanks. I think I saw an Escalade driver not texting once, but only because she was too busy going after a booger while rooting around on the floor for her cellphone and putting another SpongeBob DVD in the player for her stupid kids.
Boycott Mitsubishi IMO. (Click.)

I apologize for the length of this post, I tried to shorten it, but there was a lot to say, I guess.

I live near a trio of municipalities in the suburbs NE of Fort Worth: Trophy Club, Westlake, and Southlake, TX. These are among the wealthiest communities in the U.S.A. (The Vaquero Club in Westlake is, per capita, the wealthiest neighborhood in the U.S.A.)

Most of the residents are members of the elite in Dallas-Fort Worth. There are professional athletes, CEO's & board members of international corporations, big oil, politicians, celebrities, old money, the movers and shakers, they are all there. These people are the "Alpha's" of society, and that personality trait shows loudly and clearly in their driving habits. :dodgy:

Hwy 114 is a 6-8 lane freeway that passes through those municipalities from Texas Motor Speedway and points west, to DFW Int'l Airport and points east. Driving/riding on Hwy 114 can be like a NASCAR race, the participants are mostly in high end SUV's of all types, LandRovers, BMWs, Mercedes, Porsches, Escalades, Lexus, Infiniti, etc. You see Ferraris, Maseratis, Bentleys, Lamborghinis, the occasional Rolls-Royce, Limos of all sizes and shapes. I saw a couple of teenagers in a Shelby Cobra last Friday, they were playing cat and mouse with a couple of teenage girls in a 2014' Vette. Oh yeah, it's Texas, did I mention the giant monster style pick up trucks? (I call them Tonka trucks).

A large portion of these drivers are texting, primping, talking on the phone, reading the financial pages, all of the things you would expect, at 75 mph and beyond. Many of them think they are indestructible, you very often are all that's between them and the spot in the road that they currently wish to occupy. I've seen more than a couple serious crashes on this road, usually someone doing something stupid. I once saw a pair of Hummers sideswipe each other,...twice...., at high speeds, in snow and ice, each trying to move to the center lane from opposite sides of the road. They both thought they were above the laws of nature, the elements, and physics. :huh:

When riding a motorcycle here you are truly invisible, and you better ride that way. Riding your bike or driving a car on this highway, is always an exercise in defensive tactics. I've employed every defensive maneuver I know at one time or another on this freeway. The torque, power, smooth shifting, and maneuverability of the CB1100 are all very much appreciated when riding here. Sometimes, If I want a low stress day, I just take the service road, (65 mph is survival speed there).

If you are on a Texas road, and you see "big hair", (any color), with a pair of giant sunglasses swept back, atop the hair, (or a large Stetson Hat) and this person is driving a vehicle of any type, be prepared to evade. The odds are strong that something bad is about to happen. If there is a cell phone involved, you may as well start planning your maneuver.

I know these are common problems in most densely populated urban areas, I have observed them in many places across the country. But.... it just seems to be a little worse on HWY 114 in Tarrant County. :dodgy:

Be alert, defensive, anticipate, stay safe. :biker:

 

[calamarichris_imp]

No need to apologize. I'm a pre-Millennial, so I don't have a completely puny attention span.

I know those people. They Summer here in North Coastal San Diego County. The nicer hotels fill up with them, and our local campgrounds fill up with the Saharizonans with all their Confederate/Nascar flags, cigarette butts, burning garbage in their campfires, and 6-gpm (it's gpm, not mpg) RV's.

An MSF safety course instructor said two things that have stuck with me over the years. (Jeebus--over 21 years now! That was in '93.):

~"Due to their superior acceleration, braking, and handling capabilities, motorcycles are the safest vehicles on the road." [Pause while incredulity builds in the classroom...] "UP TO, the point of impact."

~"Riding a motorcycle in traffic is like being the only Saxon on the field without any armor on. Sure, you can duck, weave, and dodge all those other guys in their clunky armor, but once they even nick you, thy game is over."

 

[the Ferret]

~"Riding a motorcycle in traffic is like being the only Saxon on the field without any armor on. Sure, you can duck, weave, and dodge all those other guys in their clunky armor, but once they even nick you, thy game is over."

omg that is funny.. :rofl:

you guys are on a roll this week. 3 great quotes in the last couple of days

the mosquito on the testicles one

and the ship coming in while at the train station one.

funny funny stuff!

 

[Tortuga_imp]

No need to apologize. I'm a pre-Millennial, so I don't have a completely puny attention span.

I know those people. They Summer here in North Coastal San Diego County. The nicer hotels fill up with them, and our local campgrounds fill up with the Saharizonans with all their Confederate/Nascar flags, cigarette butts, burning garbage in their campfires, and 6-gpm (it's gpm, not mpg) RV's.

An MSF safety course instructor said two things that have stuck with me over the years. (Jeebus--over 21 years now! That was in '93.):

~"Due to their superior acceleration, braking, and handling capabilities, motorcycles are the safest vehicles on the road." [Pause while incredulity builds in the classroom...] "UP TO, the point of impact."

~"Riding a motorcycle in traffic is like being the only Saxon on the field without any armor on. Sure, you can duck, weave, and dodge all those other guys in their clunky armor, but once they even nick you, thy game is over."

I like it!

This is a little rough cause I don't quite get the primary ratio.

the 13 5th gear is 30/29= 1.0345 which is taller than the 14 5th gear (1.074) and tha 13 has a taller sprocket ratio.

at 70mph in 5th, the 14 turns about 200+ rpm more than the 13.

at 70, the 14 in 6th turns about 200 rpm less than the 13 in 5th.

Unless I'm wrong, which is entirely possible.

200 rpm? Hardly seems worth the effort. I don't feel bad at all having a 5 speed.

200 rpm? Hardly seems worth the effort. I don't feel bad at all having a 5 speed.
Agreed, what a big fuss about nothing.

I'd wager that with less shifting to do, the 13 rider can get up to cruising speed quicker and smoother, and his boot leather will last longer!

 

[calamarichris_imp]

Boots are a lot cheaper to replace than engines. And I'd rather be the guy with the overdrive who never uses it, but still has it, than the guy without. It's not about top speed, it's about engine preservation and prolongation. More rpm equals more piston speed equals more cylinder wear. 200 additional RPM is quite minor for that one minute you're measuring it to determine the gearing. But if you spent just 6 hours riding that day, that would be an additional (unnecessary) 72,000 rpm spun in one day.
I understand why there is a large incentive among many in our midst not to let the resale value of our existing overdriveless bikes slip, and I sympathize, but I'd probably buy a Vespa or even another Harley before I'd buy a 5-speed. But that's just my opinion, which is based pretty heavily on my riding conditions in the wide-open American West where I live.

Okay, it's a little bit about top-speed. Star Trek would have been pretty boring if Zefram Cochran had never invented warp drive.

 

[Guth_imp]

If that is where I was going to be riding, then ultimately I'd be more worried about my access to coffee than how many RPMs my engine was turning.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[calamarichris_imp]

But drinking coffee only intensifies your awareness of the rpms and the scraping-scraping-scraping of the piston rings against the cylinder walls. It's not obsession... it's just intense awareness.

Also, going faster equals adrenaline equals awakeness.

 

[Guth_imp]

Perhaps the coffee wouldn't be enough.

Boots are a lot cheaper to replace than engines. And I'd rather be the guy with the overdrive who never uses it, but still has it, than the guy without. It's not about top speed, it's about engine preservation and prolongation. More rpm equals more piston speed equals more cylinder wear. 200 additional RPM is quite minor for that one minute you're measuring it to determine the gearing. But if you spent just 6 hours riding that day, that would be an additional (unnecessary) 72,000 rpm spun in one day.
I understand why there is a large incentive among many in our midst not to let the resale value of our existing overdriveless bikes slip, and I sympathize, but I'd probably buy a Vespa or even another Harley before I'd buy a 5-speed. But that's just my opinion, which is based pretty heavily on my riding conditions in the wide-open American West where I live.

Okay, it's a little bit about top-speed. Star Trek would have been pretty boring if Zefram Cochran had never invented warp drive.

Whoa. Just a minute now. Earlier you stated this:

Hey, Cormanus, thus far it's either CB11 or Bonneville T100 with a few mods. So far we're leaning pretty heavily toward the prettier Bonneville, but an honest OVERdrive might be enough to lure me. (But both Triumph and Big-H are lucky that Kawasaki ain't bringing the W800 to my puny, small-minded Isle, because it's a superior bike in every respect.)

So as part of those "few mods" are you going to be cramming a sixth gear into the Bonnie? As far as I'm aware, the W800 is also a 5-speed. That scraping-scraping-scraping that you're so keenly aware of might not be piston rings against the cylinder walls. :idea:

 

[calamarichris_imp]

Kudos on your research, however, I still stand by my lack of contradiction.
If Honda had never produced a 6th speed on the CB11, I wouldn't even return to this forum, because I'd already be riding a T100 with the peashooter pipes and Thruxton bars.
But the CB11's 6th speed (and the 39 or 38-tooth sprocket) are enough to give me pause. (I'd probably make one or two tweaks to the CB11 too.)

So blame Honda for my annoying presence here.

If it's not the piston rings against the cylinder walls, what is it then? (Now it's your turn to expose your neurotic dysfunction...)

 

[davidsargee_imp]

Boots are a lot cheaper to replace than engines. And I'd rather be the guy with the overdrive who never uses it, but still has it, than the guy without. It's not about top speed, it's about engine preservation and prolongation. More rpm equals more piston speed equals more cylinder wear. 200 additional RPM is quite minor for that one minute you're measuring it to determine the gearing. But if you spent just 6 hours riding that day, that would be an additional (unnecessary) 72,000 rpm spun in one day.
I understand why there is a large incentive among many in our midst not to let the resale value of our existing overdriveless bikes slip, and I sympathize, but I'd probably buy a Vespa or even another Harley before I'd buy a 5-speed. But that's just my opinion, which is based pretty heavily on my riding conditions in the wide-open American West where I live.

Okay, it's a little bit about top-speed. Star Trek would have been pretty boring if Zefram Cochran had never invented warp drive.

I am one that does not care about the 6-speed. Unless the lion's share of your riding occurs at highway/freeway speeds, you will not use it that much. I had a CB900 Custom, with a dual range transmission, you could say that it was a 10-speed. Then, like now, my riding habits really didn't justify a need for 6 gears.

ALL bikes, and cars, for that matter, slip in value. Except for a few rare cases, a new bike or car is worth the most it will ever be worth, before you drive it away from the dealership. Resale value is not a big priority for me, no way of knowing what it will be worth when I, (or my kids, after they inherit it), finally sell it. I doubt the resale is suffering all that much over "only" having a 5-speed tranny. There are a lot of bikes out there with 5-speed transmissions, people buy them.

I have no quarrel with anyone that likes Triumph Bonnevilles, or the Kawasaki version, they are pretty bikes, but they don't compare to the CB1100. I researched the Bonny, the only thing the triumph twin offers is aesthetics,(and that is a matter of perspective). Functionally, the CB1100 is hands down superior in every way, (even with just 5 speeds). The Honda is smoother, has more power, better suspension, a much better finish, it is undoubtedly more reliable, etc. The Honda is simply a more capable bike, and when I was shopping, it cost less than the Bonny. For me, there was no comparison.

 

[Tortuga_imp]

:rofl:

If that is where I was going to be riding, then ultimately I'd be more worried about my access to coffee than how many RPMs my engine was turning.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

:rofl:

Boots are a lot cheaper to replace than engines. And I'd rather be the guy with the overdrive who never uses it, but still has it, than the guy without. It's not about top speed, it's about engine preservation and prolongation. More rpm equals more piston speed equals more cylinder wear. 200 additional RPM is quite minor for that one minute you're measuring it to determine the gearing. But if you spent just 6 hours riding that day, that would be an additional (unnecessary) 72,000 rpm spun in one day.
I understand why there is a large incentive among many in our midst not to let the resale value of our existing overdriveless bikes slip, and I sympathize, but I'd probably buy a Vespa or even another Harley before I'd buy a 5-speed. But that's just my opinion, which is based pretty heavily on my riding conditions in the wide-open American West where I live.


Okay, it's a little bit about top-speed. Star Trek would have been pretty boring if Zefram Cochran had never invented warp drive.

Mate, resale value worries me far less than your propensity to use unsavoury sized pictures to make your null point.

200 rpm is going to save your engine, your life, your sanity? Get a grip my friend. You're here to push buttons. I'm English and I wouldn't buy a Triumph Bonneville (bought my last brand new Triumph in 2004) because they're made in Thailand, and are pretty crap. The three cylinder bikes are truly epic machines, but what you're into is a cheap knock off repro.

Kawasaki W800...really? I looked at one and the salesman said "seriously mate, I'd refuse to sell that to you, you've got too much life left in you, that's a "last bike" for old codgers who want to pretend they're still bikers"

Boots are a lot cheaper to replace than engines. And I'd rather be the guy with the overdrive who never uses it, but still has it, than the guy without. It's not about top speed, it's about engine preservation and prolongation. More rpm equals more piston speed equals more cylinder wear. 200 additional RPM is quite minor for that one minute you're measuring it to determine the gearing. But if you spent just 6 hours riding that day, that would be an additional (unnecessary) 72,000 rpm spun in one day.
I understand why there is a large incentive among many in our midst not to let the resale value of our existing overdriveless bikes slip, and I sympathize, but I'd probably buy a Vespa or even another Harley before I'd buy a 5-speed. But that's just my opinion, which is based pretty heavily on my riding conditions in the wide-open American West where I live.


Okay, it's a little bit about top-speed. Star Trek would have been pretty boring if Zefram Cochran had never invented warp drive.

I am one that does not care about the 6-speed. Unless the lion's share of your riding occurs at highway/freeway speeds, you will not use it that much. I had a CB900 Custom, with a dual range transmission, you could say that it was a 10-speed. Then, like now, my riding habits really didn't justify a need for 6 gears.

ALL bikes, and cars, for that matter, slip in value. Except for a few rare cases, a new bike or car is worth the most it will ever be worth, before you drive it away from the dealership. Resale value is not a big priority for me, no way of knowing what it will be worth when I, (or my kids, after they inherit it), finally sell it. I doubt the resale is suffering all that much over "only" having a 5-speed tranny. There are a lot of bikes out there with 5-speed transmissions, people buy them.

I have no quarrel with anyone that likes Triumph Bonnevilles, or the Kawasaki version, they are pretty bikes, but they don't compare to the CB1100. I researched the Bonny, the only thing the triumph twin offers is aesthetics,(and that is a matter of perspective). Functionally, the CB1100 is hands down superior in every way, (even with just 5 speeds). The Honda is smoother, has more power, better suspension, a much better finish, it is undoubtedly more reliable, etc. The Honda is simply a more capable bike, and when I was shopping, it cost less than the Bonny. For me, there was no comparison.

I am one that does not care about the 6-speed. Unless the lion's share of your riding occurs at highway/freeway speeds, you will not use it that much. I had a CB900 Custom, with a dual range transmission, you could say that it was a 10-speed. Then, like now, my riding habits really didn't justify a need for 6 gears.

ALL bikes, and cars, for that matter, slip in value. Except for a few rare cases, a new bike or car is worth the most it will ever be worth, before you drive it away from the dealership. Resale value is not a big priority for me, no way of knowing what it will be worth when I, (or my kids, after they inherit it), finally sell it. I doubt the resale is suffering all that much over "only" having a 5-speed tranny. There are a lot of bikes out there with 5-speed transmissions, people buy them.

I have no quarrel with anyone that likes Triumph Bonnevilles, or the Kawasaki version, they are pretty bikes, but they don't compare to the CB1100. I researched the Bonny, the only thing the triumph twin offers is aesthetics,(and that is a matter of perspective). Functionally, the CB1100 is hands down superior in every way, (even with just 5 speeds). The Honda is smoother, has more power, better suspension, a much better finish, it is undoubtedly more reliable, etc. The Honda is simply a more capable bike, and when I was shopping, it cost less than the Bonny. For me, there was no comparison.
Well said! I find on Britain's twisty country roads I ride between third, fourth and fifth gear. Having been a former instructor I tend to try to ride in the power band ( low gear ) for engine braking mid corner, and thus haven't been able to do so yet on my 300 odd mile CB (breaking in).

I knew a man who rode a T100 (R.I.P Pete) and he got rid quickly and bought a Victory.

I know the DP of a Triumph dealership and he was all over my bike when I showed it to him and they have a Honda franchise too. He was exasperated that I'd had to buy from elsewhere because they'd had no stock.

I think this guy should go and buy his dream bike, because he seems to live in a dream.

Honda CB1100 - the bike for the guy who doesn't Over Analyse things, and just loves to ride a great bike.

If people don't want to join our club, it makes me enjoy my bike even more.

We are the Yoda riders of motorcycling.

 

[Guth_imp]

Kudos on your research, however, I still stand by my lack of contradiction.
If Honda had never produced a 6th speed on the CB11, I wouldn't even return to this forum, because I'd already be riding a T100 with the peashooter pipes and Thruxton bars.
But the CB11's 6th speed (and the 39 or 38-tooth sprocket) are enough to give me pause. (I'd probably make one or two tweaks to the CB11 too.)

So blame Honda for my annoying presence here.

If it's not the piston rings against the cylinder walls, what is it then? (Now it's your turn to expose your neurotic dysfunction...)

That would be the sound of your brain wrestling with common sense.

I honestly don't know what it is that that you're really after in order to justify a bike purchase, but hopefully you'll figure it out. If that is truly your intention.

Just try to remember that the things which matter to you might not matter nearly as much to the next guy. We all have different priorities. In your case, you seemingly have different priorities from one post to the next. Trolling perhaps?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Tortuga_imp]

I think this guy is here to push some buttons, from his terminology, praise of inferior bikes, and general argumentative nature,

I would brand him a nut sack, if not exclusively for the posting of a screensaver sized picture on a 'bound to be' inflammatory and lively thread.

Just my tuppence worth.