Fuel Injection Problem with a 2014 California model

[Lord Popgun]

Deanoh,

They're are not to be adjusted according to the service manual--set at the factory. If a competent motorcycle mechanic could adjust them, well I don't know as I am not a motorcycle mechanic. That air leak suggestion sounds like an idea and I THINK Red Mist suggested that once.

Edit for spelling.

[Red Mist_imp]

[url=attachment.php?aid=1317]Fuel Injection Sync 4-21-14.pptx (Size: 530.44 KB / Downloads: 38) Hello gentlemen. I will not respond to the people who questioned why I did not have my bike inspected on a dynamometer, or why I was relying on seat-of-the-pants riding impressions from skilled and experienced riders/mechanics. Nor will I reply to the comment about comparing the operating characteristics of a V4 versus an in-line 4. I will offer "proof" that my 2014 CB1100 does not run properly. Actually, the diagnosis was very simple, for anyone owning a $600.00 electronic vacuum gauge (as I would expect any qualified / authorized Honda dealer to have). As you can plainly see from the picture below, the fuel injectors on this bike are clearly not synchronized properly. Sorry if I "offended" any members of this forum by suggesting that there could possibly be some sort of manufacturing defect to our beloved CB1100.

I certainly am not offended. But you posted a concern and quite a number of us took a good deal of time and trouble trying to assist you. Your initial complaint involved SOTP impressions. You probably know by now that this is not a problem that anyone else has experienced; it's not a common problem, nor even an uncommon problem. It's a first.

Before running into 6 pages on a thread, it really would have been helpful to have had the vacuum gage information in the OP. It's clear that there's an issue with your particular bike and it looks like you're on track to get it resolved.

This forum's been around for about year now, and while there's some good information here -- as on any forum -- it's still just an Internet forum. Most members lurk, a few post, and a few of those have some pretty good background. I'd figure you were wanting those folks to respond.

We are a polite bunch. If you'd posted this to Gixxer.com, another forum of which I'm a member, without specifics, the moderators would have drummed your post out of town in an ignominious demise. And they would not have been the least bit polite. However, I know I can trust that forum to give me the best possible information.

We want to help, but we need specifics. It's the old credo, GIGO. Help us to help you.

I thought the flies on these were all on the same shaft and not adjustable. Could valves or an air leak or something else be causing the vacuum difference? I know you will keep us posted on how this is fixed.

I agree with Deanohh here. Fuel injected bikes use an entirely different protocol than our older carbureted motorcycles. The vacuum balancing at idle was handled by an individual adjustment screw for each carburetor. Float bowls, gravity feed, main and pilot jets, needles...none of that obtains with fuel injection.

All of this still begs the question (as the bike is new and under warranty): what is AHMC's analysis of the problem? If we attempt to fix a problem like this on a brand-new motorcycle, we run the risk of voiding the warranty.

I would like to see the gentleman's problem resolved as much as anyone, but a simple vacuum gage analysis won't accomplish that. These motorcycles -- as we have seen in the various threads dealing with speed limitations and ECU reflash/reprogramming options -- are complex and we need to begin our analyses with the machine's central computer, or ECU, and work our way out from there.

This is the biggest bugaboo I've seen on the CB1100 forum; it's a bike that attracts an older buyer who's generally not familiar with the technologies used in the latest machines.

OTOH, a forum like Gixxer.com, which is rife with younger riders, is pretty savvy when it comes to electronics.

Start with the black box and work your way out.

[Deanohh_imp]

True, but even if the owner is a geezer like me, the ones who NEED to be savvy on this stuff are the mechanics in the dealer shops cause they're the ones that are supposed to fix this stuff. Good grief the bike is brand new and they don't seem to know cuss from shinola (formerly a common brand of shoe polish) about anything. My dealer couldn't get the seat off either and had to call Honda to figure it out...cause the manual was under the seat.

[Ridem32_imp]

Lol deanohh. Same here. My salesman went to the service dept to get a Tec and I did put key in helment lock turned key think it might release the seat. But I did not see the pull lever lol. Manual was under the seat!! Lol. But back to his bike I know how he fills with a new bike and not running up to par! I said in the beginning look for simple stuff vaccum leak , bad plug wire when he said it sputters at idle and very low rpms and runs good over 3k rpms has to be something simple EFI is much better than carbs and easy to work on. To me bottom line his dealer should of let him ride the 13 model. That might of settled it all.
Michael


3 rights make a left

[Deanohh_imp]

It shouldn't be up to the owner to diagnose his new bike, but in frustration you have to try sometimes. The last real problem I had (different bike), I went to every dealer within a days ride until I finally found one where a guy had experience with one like it and knew what he was doing.

[Red Mist_imp]

It shouldn't be up to the owner to diagnose his new bike, but in frustration you have to try sometimes. The last real problem I had (different bike), I went to every dealer within a days ride until I finally found one where a guy had experience with one like it and knew what he was doing.

+1

[Ridem32_imp]

Any word on your bike ? Let us know.
Michael

[dave]

Gentlemen, again I thank all of you for your replies. My bike has been back to the dealer 3X now. I have had conversations with two different Honda representatives over the phone (the dealer provided the phone number for Honda service), and Honda has not done a thing to my bike. (It's funny, but I asked both Honda representatives on the phone and neither of them was a mechanic or had any real mechanical background.) They hooked my bike up to a computer and performed a diagnostics test twice, and found nothing wrong both times (I didn't think they would find anything wrong). They did not perform a vacuum test either time. Their "official" explanation is that the injectors come set from the factory and they (Honda mechanics) cannot adjust them because to do so would be breaking the law (has to do with emissions). My bike is definitely running better now but this is due to it being broken-in (1,200 miles). It still gurgles at light throttle openings below 3,000 RPM. Not only is this annoying riding around town, but when I'm riding the canyons and doing a lot of shifting into and out of corners. When I coast into the corners with the throttle off, down-shift, and gently turn the throttle on when exiting the corners, if the RPM is below 3,000 the engine gurgles (stumbles), and the power drops off below 3,000 RPM. But, as my father taught me, if you want something done right you have to do it yourself, and I will correct this problem myself. (Sometimes you have to pick your battles.) I own a mercury manometer, and as soon as I get my Honda service manual I will figure it out. Honda acknowledged that they are adjustable, and I can see what appears to be adjustment screws located on the bottom of the throttle bodies. Just in case anybody is interested, I will post my results in a week or two.

[Ridem32_imp]

Yes let us know for sure. Have you rode another cb1100 at all yet? I think you should ride one to compare it to. My never stumbles at all at any rpms even if I lug mine, which I don't but I test all my bikes out to see how they lug & ride them hard to see how they preform
Michael

[wayne van horn_imp]

maybe you should talk to a lawyer about what your state says about buying a lemon, maybe you can get your money back.