CB1100 Idle speed instability problem

[johnf514_imp]

LOL intermittent problems are just the worst. In the mid 70's I was the manager of a Kawasaki shop. I had a customer complain that sometimes his bike would not start, but just sometimes. I told him to bring it. I gave it to my head mechanic. Over the next couple of days he tried starting the bike 50 times and every time varrom. Every time he walked past it, he would turn the key, hit the button and varrom. I called the customer and told him we could not duplicate his problem. He came and picked it up. The next day he called and said it wouldn't start. Bring it back in. We then over the next few days proceeded to start it 100 times. Every time varrom. We could not get it not to start. Customer came and got it and we never heard from him again. Don't know if it quit again or not, but it never would as long as we had it.

That's funny! But that's what I'm afraid will happen if I leave the bike with service, particularly with the cooler temps. They'll do their $115 diagnostic and will say "can't replicate issue" because they it won't act up on a test ride of 5-10 miles.

For the couple of members who had the IACV replaced or the throttle assembly, I wonder how the techs went about determining that. Was the bike hooked up to a computer? Was the high / low idle issue replicated while at the shop? Did they physically "open things up" and test parts? I know Riko had a video, and I think that's what I'll do and show them before leaving bike for any extended time.

When I brought my bike into the shop (for the 3rd time) with the high idle issue, I turned the bike on and showed them how the bike idled. Sometimes, the bike would start as normal, but in my case, once the high idle condition presented itself, it would undoubtedly return, even if the bike exhibited normal behavior.

The tech tested the bike, figured out the IACV was faulty (I seem to recall some issue with there being a bad connection between the IACV and the ECU), and replaced the IACV (5 months before the extended warranty ran out).

I was very happy I bought a used bike with an extended, transferrable warranty.

I've never purchased an extended warranty on anything, and I've never been in a position where had I had one, I would have benefited. I figured all that money I saved could be used if I ever did have an issue outside of warranty.

Well, here I am : )

Thanks, johnf514, for that extra bit of info. I hope to talk to the service manager tomorrow--hopefully he has read the letter I left for him and we can talk about how to go about diagnosing an intermittent problem.

My fault, didn't mean for my post to sound chastising. The extended warranty came with the bike and I would not have bought the extension if it hadn't. Especially for a Honda! It was fortunate happenstance and had nothing to do with my (lack of) consumer prowess.

[postoak_imp]

So let's go back to a bad connection between the IACV and the ECU. Is this as simple as a wire running from the IACV into the wiring harness and then over to the ECU?

[Lord Popgun]

I think there are 4 wires. There is a connector on the IACV motor and obviously on the ECM. I don't remember what is in between. I'd have to look at the wiring diagram and it isn't handy at the moment.

[736cc_imp]

At 15,000 miles my 2013 CB1100 had the high idle issue a year ago immediately after trying to start with a very weak battery, and it went back to normal after re-charging, battery disconnect, throttle twist reset routine, and several high-rpm runs thru the gears. Others tried same fix and got mixed results.
1 year later I now run a Yosh titanium pipe w/ the O2 sensor eliminator plug widget and it still idles perfectly normal, 7500 miles later. Now it has 23,000 miles.
I wonder if anybody here runs the O2 sensor eliminator widget but still has a high idle; that would prove its not the fix. Or do a new O2 sensor replacement (or the eliminator plug) on a high idler and post results. The special O2 removal tool is required for the latter test.
Positive or negative results from the process of elimination is kinda like throwing parts at a problem but seeing real world documented results is helpful.

Critical put-down posts from know-it-all “experts” will be ignored (sometimes they deserve the appropriate humorous responses) but hopefully they learned their lesson and will contribute in a positive manner in the future, and refrain from being negative.

[johnf514_imp]

Off topic, but I REALLY like the tail and fender kit on your bike, 736CC. What is that?

[736cc_imp]

Off topic, but I REALLY like the tail and fender kit on your bike, 736CC. What is that?

MIZ seat, tail and fender eliminator from Samurider

[pdedse]

LOL intermittent problems are just the worst. In the mid 70's I was the manager of a Kawasaki shop. I had a customer complain that sometimes his bike would not start, but just sometimes. I told him to bring it. I gave it to my head mechanic. Over the next couple of days he tried starting the bike 50 times and every time varrom. Every time he walked past it, he would turn the key, hit the button and varrom. I called the customer and told him we could not duplicate his problem. He came and picked it up. The next day he called and said it wouldn't start. Bring it back in. We then over the next few days proceeded to start it 100 times. Every time varrom. We could not get it not to start. Customer came and got it and we never heard from him again. Don't know if it quit again or not, but it never would as long as we had it.

That's funny! But that's what I'm afraid will happen if I leave the bike with service, particularly with the cooler temps. They'll do their $115 diagnostic and will say "can't replicate issue" because they it won't act up on a test ride of 5-10 miles.

For the couple of members who had the IACV replaced or the throttle assembly, I wonder how the techs went about determining that. Was the bike hooked up to a computer? Was the high / low idle issue replicated while at the shop? Did they physically "open things up" and test parts? I know Riko had a video, and I think that's what I'll do and show them before leaving bike for any extended time.

When I brought my bike into the shop (for the 3rd time) with the high idle issue, I turned the bike on and showed them how the bike idled. Sometimes, the bike would start as normal, but in my case, once the high idle condition presented itself, it would undoubtedly return, even if the bike exhibited normal behavior.

The tech tested the bike, figured out the IACV was faulty (I seem to recall some issue with there being a bad connection between the IACV and the ECU), and replaced the IACV (5 months before the extended warranty ran out).

I was very happy I bought a used bike with an extended, transferrable warranty.

I've never purchased an extended warranty on anything, and I've never been in a position where had I had one, I would have benefited. I figured all that money I saved could be used if I ever did have an issue outside of warranty.

Well, here I am : )

Thanks, johnf514, for that extra bit of info. I hope to talk to the service manager tomorrow--hopefully he has read the letter I left for him and we can talk about how to go about diagnosing an intermittent problem.

My fault, didn't mean for my post to sound chastising. The extended warranty came with the bike and I would not have bought the extension if it hadn't. Especially for a Honda! It was fortunate happenstance and had nothing to do with my (lack of) consumer prowess.

My fault, didn't mean for my post to sound chastising. The extended warranty came with the bike and I would not have bought the extension if it hadn't. Especially for a Honda! It was fortunate happenstance and had nothing to do with my (lack of) consumer prowess.
Oh...I didn't take it that way at all. I was just explaining where I'm at if I am told a repair is going to cost big $$. In theory, all those warranties I didn't purchase should now pay for this idle problem. Question is, would I really have a repair done if it costs somewhere between $1-3k? (based on what I have been told about an IACV or throttle assembly replacement). Other options just living with it, or maybe trying an IACV replacement myself. But I went to dealer to get a conversation going and I'll let that play out.

[Riko_imp]

A very common idle problem (and fix) w/ automobiles is replacing a defective O2 sensor. Has anybody tried that remedy to our idle puzzle? They get cooked in the cat and throw-off the computer mix.
Also, there’s a widget called a lamba loop thingamajig
http://cb1100forum.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=948

if that would be the root cause, it would have been spotted that easily, but no

If it was the lambda sensor we wouldn't have 51 pages and counting..

if that would be the root cause, it would have been spotted that easily, but no

If it was the lambda sensor we wouldn't have 51 pages and counting..
Has anybody in fact had the idle issue and replaced the O2 sensor (or lamba loop) and reported the actual results here in the 51 pages?

if that would be the root cause, it would have been spotted that easily, but no

If it was the lambda sensor we wouldn't have 51 pages and counting..
Has anybody in fact had the idle issue and replaced the O2 sensor (or lamba loop) and reported the actual results here in the 51 pages? no, not here, not on facebook, and I personally chcekced with my dealer, the lambda sensor was good.

So, thats not the root cause of the idling/stalling issue.
Again, if the root cause was that easy and simple to detect and replace as a faulty lambda sensor, there wouldn't been 51 pages and counting here.
Same thing I red on forums and facebool pages worldwide.
I refer to the German board, the French board and the Taiwanese and Thai facebook pages wich I have been eyeballing the period I had my stalling issue.

Lambda sensors ain't the cause, ther were many asian owners that replaced the exhaust with a non lambda entry and still had the CB stalling.

[lederkombi_imp]

That is sort of what I am doing.

What I have started is

Name, country, original post date as far as I can tell, and what was done to cure it

Example (3 of first 11) from first 15 page thread

Jeff Hark USA 1/2016 IACV replaced
Glackie Canada 9/2016 TPS reset
Tory Thailand 10/2016 ECU refresh

Notice, 3 countries 3 different cures

I did not note year, model of bike most were 2014 EX's I think but I can gather that info if posted

Headed to page 1 of this thread now will report entire results from both threads when completed.

Hi
You may add me too.

CB1100EX/2014, 4'900km, Switzerland.
Since today, I have the same problem as Riko had.

[lederkombi_imp]

Hi there

I'm new to this forum and I'm here because of the same problem as Riko had. Riko wrote months ago in the german forum (where I write under the same name as here) and at that time my CB1100EX was running fine.
Today I started my machine after a 3 break an I now have the idle/stalling problem.
If I can not fix it (warranty is gone as the bike is from 2014 and there are only 2 years warranty in Switzerland), I will sell the bike and it will be my first and last Honda!


For me it is absolutly key that Rikos problem could be solved with a new Throttle unit! Lots of solutions are posted here, but one keything is, that the new unit consists of a new IACV, IACV-Stepper Motor and also the TPS. Every part of those is key to the amount of air and fuel during idle which lasts in RPM for idle.
I'm quiet sure that the problem is based on one of those 3 parts. The EOT (Engine Oil Temperature) Sensor may be deliver information for the ECU (and disconnecting it my help to prevent the error), bur I'm quiet sure, that it doesn't belong to the error. Same for the O2 Sensor/Lambda.