Rode a DCT bike today

[the Ferret]

Rode down to my local dealer today to pick up a gallon of GN4 for an upcoming oil change and the owner showed me a CTX? 700 With DCT (dual clutch transmission) that he took in on trade. Care to ride it? He says. Sure! say I. Never ridden a bike with DCT but have been wanting to. Last auto bike I rode that wasn't a scooter was in 1976 (CB750A).

The bike had a button on the right switch assy you pressed for neutral, drive mode 1st gear, or sport mode 1st gear. And a finger swith for upshifting and a thumb switch for down shifting on the left bar switch assy ( but you don't even have to mess with that if you don't want to). I decided to try drive mode 1st, and let the bike do the shifting. Start bike, click right hand button from N to D1 and give it the gas and it takes off. It quickly shifts itself into 2 nd and you feel a slight bump as it shifts. Then you feel the bump again and you are in 3 rd and so forth up to 6 th. As I slowed down to turn around I could feel the bumps reversing as it downshifted back to 1 st. Not alot of get up and go in Drive mode. Let me try Sport Mode, so I toggled the right button to S1 and took off. Much peppier in sport mode but it still wanted to shift early and did, bump, bump, bump bump up to 6 th, and bump bump bump down to first as I slowed down to turn around again. Time to try the left paddles. Take off and bump bump I'm all of a sudden up to third and haven't touched anything, so I thumb the left - paddle and the bike down shifts to second, then I accelerate and hit the finger trigger and shift third, fourth, fifth and sixth. Then start slowing and hit the thumb to downshift to 5,4,3, and let the bike downshift itself into 2 and 1 as I slow down to turn around.

My conclusion, it was weird and although shifting was seamless except for the bumps you felt as it chaged gears, I didn't like the bike deciding when I should shift ( even though my truck does it all for me). It wasn't as smooth as driving an auto car or truck. Hard to explain, you will just have to beg a ride for yourself to see what I mean. Definitly a new experience and one Honda believes in.

Can't imagine riding the new Africa Twin 1000 in the dirt with one of these transmissions.

 

[redbirds_imp]

Your conclusion seems to line up with the tests I've read. The system works very well but few would actually prefer the DCT.

Still a question whether the DCT proves to be a sales success for Honda. I tend to think not but I hope I'm wrong.

 

[Cormanus]

They'll get better, don't you think? Remember the 3-speed automatic transmission of the 1960s (and Paul Stookey's stand up act about needing your bands tightened)? They were clunky and not really good at all. The VW Jetta I sold recently had an amazing 6-speed automatic transmission. I was hardly aware of it changing and it mostly did it at the right time. Indeed I think it may have taught me a couple of things about using gears better. I can imagine DCT will get better over time.

 

[LongRanger_imp]

For what it's worth, I rode a 6-speed NC750X in Italy last summer (arguably similar to the 700) and was less than impressed during spirited riding. The bike had a relatively low redline (5200 rpm?), so it made decent torque, but not much hp. I frequently banged into the rev limiter. But the Honda heated grips were awesome!

 

[kmoney_imp]

There was an interview with a Honda engineer on Visordown (I think) and he was talking about how they want to ,and are currently working to, adapt the DCT to Sportbikes -- the only problem being the weight penalty. Even with the 10kg weight penalty of the DCT one of their sport bikes fitted with a DCT would be faster than an equal manual transmission bike. Apparently if they could put a DCT on their Moto GP bike it would be faster than a bike of the same weight using their current seamless gearbox (I. E., the current RC213 with 10kg of ballast added).

 

[kennyw]

According to one salesman I spoke with, what you won't experience during a "test" ride with a DCT is that the computer is supposed to learn your driving habits and start shifting the way you would. You rode a used bike that learned someone else's riding style is my guess (if the sales guy was right).

 

[quietguy_imp]

I owned the CTX700 prior to the CB1100. Mine did have DCT, and I thought it was incredible. I spent the first week or two pulling on the phantom clutch lever...

 

[Chapomis_imp]

I have DCT on my Spyder and it's fantastic. Up shifting only happens automatically when it hits its rev limits, which has never happened for me. I always up shift with the paddle when I want. Down shifting happens automatically and is always waiting in first gear when the light turns green.

 

[4 Paws_imp]

Wife has a Can-Am with their version of the DCT. Take a lot of getting used to. Fully integrated brakes also.If I had a reason to I could get used to it but my habits are so ingrained now it would be a fight to change. No interest.

Local BMW dealer has a Honda CT and a Yamaha 900 on the floor taken in on trade. Might have to test ride them.

 

[GoldOxide_imp]

For what it's worth, I rode a 6-speed NC750X in Italy last summer (arguably similar to the 700) and was less than impressed during spirited riding. The bike had a relatively low redline (5200 rpm?), so it made decent torque, but not much hp. I frequently banged into the rev limiter. But the Honda heated grips were awesome!

Yeah, I read about other rider reviews about topping out too easily. It is a low revving producer. Bouncing off the top would be tiresome pretty quickly.

 

[rboe]

Like the CB, the NX700/750 is not designed to be a sport bike but a frugal commuter. It's aim is squeezing the nickle (and mpg's) so to use sporty metrics is a bit unfair. Unless you are looking to buy sporty then it's fair to blacklist the bike as being outside your needs.

However; I'll note that you do not wring the snot out of your CB so I would consider you a potential NX owner. Maybe you just need to ride one for a couple weeks so it learns how you ride. That big trunk in the "gas tank" seems to be extremely useful.

 

[the Ferret]

Lol you guys do realize this thread is 3 years old.

A lot of old threads are resurfacing lately so some of the op's are no longer around to read new responses. Some of the issues originally stated are no longer issues.

This has been like time travel and deja-vu all over again for me (to quote Yogi Bera.)

 

[GoldOxide_imp]

I believe Honda is being smart by introducing the NC750X to the masses in an attempt to attract new, young riders (e.g. millennials who are said to not be interested in the clutch - like Formula 1 racer I suppose ... not!), and to the senior riding population whose limbs don't respond the way they used to. I think these are reasonable and practical assumptions.

In 2018 Honda raised red line to 7500 RPM, which is better for what the bike is. New torque control together with the existing manual override provide options for those who wish to squeeze the lemon above fuel frugality.

Manual override, multiple torque control options, and the upfront helmet storage appears to be ideas borrowed by the old Aprilia Mana 850 which used essentially a heavy duty and intelligently utilized CVT.



Aprilia had considered using the 750 DOHC Shiver V-twin, but opted for the lower power 839 cc SOHC V-twin (yes, larger engine displacement) that put out about the same hp as the NC750X. The Aprilia Mana also had rear passenger under seat refueling. However, I think Honda's approach to the auto gearbox is a better solution, especially during deceleration approaching the lowest gear. I think both have similar 0 to 60 mph times of about 5.3 seconds.

 

[Lord Popgun]

I noticed that too. I think Gold is trying get his post count up

 

[the Ferret]

He's going to have a higher post cou t than me pretty soon I think lol

 

[peterbaron]

He'll slow down in summer due to riding

 

[GoldOxide_imp]

Hey y'all, I accept these as all constructive feedback.

Yes, I am pretty sure I will run out of interesting thoughts (or not interesting thoughts), and time - as PB is no doubt correct on - and when things thaw for us up here.

 

[cblais19_imp]

It’s interesting looking back at some of the previous page’s conclusions from 2016 post-Africa Twin / Goldwing introduction. Even Honda was surprised at the take rate of the DCT on the Africa Twin and GW. Both of those applications are ideal for the technology - in the AT’s case because in off-road riding you don’t have to worry about gear changes or stalling; in the GW’s case because things are nice and smooth for your pillion (to say nothing about rider demographics...).

Like a bunch of relative sales flops in the US (CB1100 anyone?), the NC700/750 exists for a market that uses their bikes in a very different way then we do over here. If my commute hadn’t shifted to a very brief one, I certainly would’ve gone with either a NC or AT with the DCT for the lovely traffic we have in the DC Metro.

 

[GoldOxide_imp]

It’s interesting looking back at some of the previous page’s conclusions from 2016 post-Africa Twin / Goldwing introduction. Even Honda was surprised at the take rate of the DCT on the Africa Twin and GW. Both of those applications are ideal for the technology - in the AT’s case because in off-road riding you don’t have to worry about gear changes or stalling; in the GW’s case because things are nice and smooth for your pillion (to say nothing about rider demographics...).

Like a bunch of relative sales flops in the US (CB1100 anyone?), the NC700/750 exists for a market that uses their bikes in a very different way then we do over here. If my commute hadn’t shifted to a very brief one, I certainly would’ve gone with either a NC or AT with the DCT for the lovely traffic we have in the DC Metro.

There is no doubt support for Honda's DCT gearbox implementation has been gaining firm traction. The demographic is changing. Honda has been doing something about it.

 

[Cormanus]

He's going to have a higher post cou t than me pretty soon I think lol

I was going to say, “Don’t worry, Ferret, he’ll have to get past popgun and me first,” but that no be too much of a challenge unless popgun brings Bubba to the game. You may just have to rely on Sea.