My new "motorcycle"

[VLJ_imp]

Islands or not, Great Britian and the United Kingdom are part of Europe. So is Iceland.

Jaguar, Rolls Royce, Aston Martin, Land Rover, McLaren, MG, Triumph, Norton, BSA, and Brough Superior are all European brands, as opposed to Asian or American makes.

Rory McIlroy, Ian Woosnam, Ian Poulter, Colin Montgomery, and Nick Faldo all played for Europe in the Ryder Cup. They didn't play for the World team in the President's Cup, which excludes European players.

Clubs from the English Premier League compete in the UEFA Champions League, which is limited to European club teams.

Europe and the rest of the world consider the UK to be part of Europe, just as Gibraltar, the Faroe Islands, and Scandinavia are part of Europe.

It is what it is.

 

[Cormanus]

You're quite right in a geographical sense, VLJ, but the past four years of political entertainment from the United Kingdom has made abundantly clear that a majority of citizens in the UK do not want any part of Europe as a political entity. The British would not see the vehicles or the football players you mentioned as European; they'd see them as British. Your distinction, with respect, may be decidedly United States of American—as opposed to American which would at lest include Canada or maybe even the array of South American countries.

At which point we descend into an unresolvable debate about whether the political or geographic determinant should prevail.

 

[Stichill]

After WWII, Great Britain did become deeply entangled with the Continent economically and politically, but not really culturally. The Continent represented two of Britain's historical foes, France and Germany. Although they could learn to cooperate and live peacefully together, they were never going to meld culturally.

In terms of vehicle design and brand identity from a historical perspective, there's definitely a difference between British makes and European makes. These lines are blurred in the modern world, but looking to the past each country's vehicles had a distinct style and character. So bringing it back on topic, that is what ferret's brother meant when he said, "...he has looked at the new ones and feels they are more European, and feels his is more British."

 

[Richard_imp]

I don’t think the British consider themselves European culturally. That’s where the phrase “Continental” comes from: to distinguish those on the mainland from those on the island.

Speaking as a Brit, that’s a nonsensical generalisation.

I’m both British and European.

 

[the Ferret]

Interesting article about that here

Home

 

[Ben70_imp]

If you're in the kitchen, you're a cookin'
If you're in the bathroom, you're a continental.

Ben

 

[VLJ_imp]

Cormanus, Great Britain's Brexit issue has mainly to do with economics. It's not a cultural thing. Yacht salesmen on the Costa Brava and hedge-fund managers in Zurich share no cultural brotherhood with beet farmers in Estonia, yet they're all still Europeans. It's the same with Hugh Grant and a family of Moldovan gypsies.

This isn't merely some provincial American point of view, either. People in South America, Africa, and Asia recognize that the UK is in Europe, and that the UK's citizens and exported goods are European.

Stichill, the UK was deeply rooted in European affairs long before WWII. Case in point: WWI! The UK does not come to France's aid in both World Wars (the first, ostensibly over an Austrian dispute; the second, over the invasion of Poland) were it not for their long-standing European member-nation alliance treaties. The UK isn't compelled by treaty to go to war when Senegal, Mongolia, or Bolivia are attacked, but they are called upon to go to war when France, the Low Countries, or any of their other European allies are attacked.

That's because the UK is and always has been one of the bulwark member-nations of western Europe.

 

[Inhouse Bob]

I had a 1992 Miata until last year when I just couldn't justify keeping it any more. It was wonderful from the start to the end and if I was RAZOR, I would have kept it in top nick and be driving it still. Last I heard it was racing at Summit Point race track.

 

[Stichill]

Cormanus, Great Britain's Brexit issue has mainly to do with economics. It's not a cultural thing. Yacht salesmen on the Costa Brava and hedge-fund managers in Zurich share no cultural brotherhood with beet farmers in Estonia, yet they're all still Europeans. It's the same with Hugh Grant and a family of Moldovan gypsies.

This isn't merely some provincial American point of view, either. People in South America, Africa, and Asia recognize that the UK is in Europe, and that the UK's citizens and exported goods are European.

Stichill, the UK was deeply rooted in European affairs long before WWII. Case in point: WWI! The UK does not come to France's aid in both World Wars (the first, ostensibly over an Austrian dispute; the second, over the invasion of Poland) were it not for their long-standing European member-nation alliance treaties. The UK isn't compelled by treaty to go to war when Senegal, Mongolia, or Bolivia are attacked, but they are called upon to go to war when France, the Low Countries, or any of their other European allies are attacked.

That's because the UK is and always has been one of the bulwark member-nations of western Europe.

Always? England has a history of waging a litany of wars with France during the time period of 1109 to 1815, which seven centuries of conflict.

I don’t think the British consider themselves European culturally. That’s where the phrase “Continental” comes from: to distinguish those on the mainland from those on the island.

Speaking as a Brit, that’s a nonsensical generalisation.

I’m both British and European.

Minority Remainer?

 

[VLJ_imp]

Interesting article about that here

Home

That same article states that 35% of French people do not feel they are European. So, is there now a question as to whether France is European too? What about Germany? Are they European? According to that silly poll, one quarter of the German population doesn't feel European.

Yeah, well, guess what? You're part of Europe. You're European. This isn't like the recent cultural phenomenon of "fluid" gender assignations, in which we let people pick and choose their gender based on how they feel about themselves on that particular Thursday.

What's probably happening in that poll is their polling subjects likely include a disproportionate number of ethnic/religious immigrants now living in European countries, who don't identify as native Europeans.

 

[Stichill]

Interesting article about that here

Home

 

[Richard_imp]

Cormanus, Great Britain's Brexit issue has mainly to do with economics. It's not a cultural thing. Yacht salesmen on the Costa Brava and hedge-fund managers in Zurich share no cultural brotherhood with beet farmers in Estonia, yet they're all still Europeans. It's the same with Hugh Grant and a family of Moldovan gypsies.

This isn't merely some provincial American point of view, either. People in South America, Africa, and Asia recognize that the UK is in Europe, and that the UK's citizens and exported goods are European.

Stichill, the UK was deeply rooted in European affairs long before WWII. Case in point: WWI! The UK does not come to France's aid in both World Wars (the first, ostensibly over an Austrian dispute; the second, over the invasion of Poland) were it not for their long-standing European member-nation alliance treaties. The UK isn't compelled by treaty to go to war when Senegal, Mongolia, or Bolivia are attacked, but they are called upon to go to war when France, the Low Countries, or any of their other European allies are attacked.

That's because the UK is and always has been one of the bulwark member-nations of western Europe.

Always? England has a history of waging a litany of wars with France during the time period of 1109 to 1815, which seven centuries of conflict.

I don’t think the British consider themselves European culturally. That’s where the phrase “Continental” comes from: to distinguish those on the mainland from those on the island.

Speaking as a Brit, that’s a nonsensical generalisation.

I’m both British and European.

Minority Remainer?

Always? England has a history of waging a litany of [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-French_Wars]wars with France during the time period of 1109 to 1815, which seven centuries of conflict.

I don’t think the British consider themselves European culturally. That’s where the phrase “Continental” comes from: to distinguish those on the mainland from those on the island.

Speaking as a Brit, that’s a nonsensical generalisation.

I’m both British and European.

Minority Remainer?

It has nothing to do with Brexit. Quite simply, it’s probably best not to try to generalise...

 

[the Ferret]

You know seeing how this is a motorcycle forum and we are supposed to be talking about CB1100s and motorcycles and we should probably drop the political talk, and I apologize for my part in it.

Comparing a sports car to a motorcycle has some validity and its worthy of discussion, but the political stuff we should drop.

 

[VLJ_imp]

Cormanus, Great Britain's Brexit issue has mainly to do with economics. It's not a cultural thing. Yacht salesmen on the Costa Brava and hedge-fund managers in Zurich share no cultural brotherhood with beet farmers in Estonia, yet they're all still Europeans. It's the same with Hugh Grant and a family of Moldovan gypsies.

This isn't merely some provincial American point of view, either. People in South America, Africa, and Asia recognize that the UK is in Europe, and that the UK's citizens and exported goods are European.

Stichill, the UK was deeply rooted in European affairs long before WWII. Case in point: WWI! The UK does not come to France's aid in both World Wars (the first, ostensibly over an Austrian dispute; the second, over the invasion of Poland) were it not for their long-standing European member-nation alliance treaties. The UK isn't compelled by treaty to go to war when Senegal, Mongolia, or Bolivia are attacked, but they are called upon to go to war when France, the Low Countries, or any of their other European allies are attacked.

That's because the UK is and always has been one of the bulwark member-nations of western Europe.

Always? England has a history of waging a litany of wars with France during the time period of 1109 to 1815, which seven centuries of conflict.

I don’t think the British consider themselves European culturally. That’s where the phrase “Continental” comes from: to distinguish those on the mainland from those on the island.

Speaking as a Brit, that’s a nonsensical generalisation.

I’m both British and European.

Minority Remainer?

Always? England has a history of waging a litany of [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-French_Wars]wars with France during the time period of 1109 to 1815, which seven centuries of conflict.
Yes, precisely, because England and France are...wait for it...European neighbors. Competing European nations, especially close geographic neighbors with conflicting political aspirations, tend to fight each other far more frequently than they fight nations from more far-flung regions of the planet.

Ever wonder why Poland and Romania have been involved in so many wars and conquests over the centuries? Think it might have anything to do with their immediate proximity to their very aggressive, fellow-European neighbors?

Interesting article about that here

[url=https://whatukthinks.org/eu/media-centre/britain-feels-less-european-than-anywhere-else-in-the-eu/]https://whatukthinks.org/eu/media-centre/britain-feels-less-european-than-anywhere-else-in-the-eu/

As I already pointed out, that stupid poll also states that a third of the French and a quarter of the Germans don't "feel European." Are we now going to entertain the notion of France and Germany not being European, or part of Europe?

 

[the Ferret]

I will assume VLJ was typing as I was so please let that be the last political post or I will have to lock this thread.

Sorry boss has rules, and I must follow them.

 

[VLJ_imp]

To be fair, this has really been more about basic history than politics. Semantics. Definitions. No one here is debating politics.

 

[Houtman_imp]

My motto is : IF YOU AIN'T DUTCH , YOU AIN'T MUCH !

 

[VLJ_imp]

I agree, and I'm not even Dutch.

 

[the Ferret]

Ever see a Van Veen motorcycle?

 

[peterbaron]

50 cc Kriedler RS Van Veen, many time world champion +++
http://www.classic50racingclub.co.uk/gp-50cc-v-v-kreidler.html

:biker: