Honda CB350 H'ness

[Tev62]

Emission regulations just show how strangled they have bikes though. My old CB350K4 make 32HP-36HP (depending on where you read). Fifty years later and a 350cc is making 20HP?

 

[Django]

My Yamaha RD 350 in the seventies had 39 HP. But then BMW S1000RR with 999cc has 212 HP, despite emission regulations.

 

[the Ferret]

Emission regulations just show how strangled they have bikes though. My old CB350K4 make 32HP-36HP (depending on where you read). Fifty years later and a 350cc is making 20HP?

Then again the CB 350 K series was a twin and the H'ness is only a single

the 1983 CB 1100 made 108 hp our CB 1100 makes only 88 both 4 cyls.

divide an 88 hp 4 cyl into 4ths and you get 22 hp per cyl

divide 88 hp 4 cyl by 2 and you get 44 hp

so both the H'ness and the CB 350K both are basically close to the same power as our CB 1100's per cylinder

 

[the Ferret]

Japanese motorcycle mfgs don't have the same mindset that KTM does. Japan doesn't build high stressed engines for the masses. Once the horsepower wars of the 70s and 80s was over, the Japanese basically quit competing for horsepower, especially Honda.

If you look up the top 20 hp bikes Honda only has 2 on that list.... one a limited edition bike based off their motogp bike, the RC213V-S that cost $184,000 plus $12k extra for the go fast kit.

Could they get 40 hp out of a street single ? I have no doubt. Could they get more than 108 hp out of an 1100cc 4 cylinder? Again, I have no doubt. But they don't, because it is not their way. They build milqtoast bikes for the everyman, not highly stressed bikes for the performance enthusiast.

Compared to a KTM 390...how many horses in a Yamaha SR 400 single? Both single cylinder bikes with a 400ish cc motor

 

[Tev62]

Emission regulations just show how strangled they have bikes though. My old CB350K4 make 32HP-36HP (depending on where you read). Fifty years later and a 350cc is making 20HP?

Then again the CB 350 K series was a twin and the H'ness is only a single

the 1983 CB 1100 made 108 hp our CB 1100 makes only 88 both 4 cyls.

divide an 88 hp 4 cyl into 4ths and you get 22 hp per cyl

divide 88 hp 4 cyl by 2 and you get 44 hp

so both the H'ness and the CB 350K both are basically close to the same power as our CB 1100's per cylinder

Then again the CB 350 K series was a twin and the H'ness is only a single

the 1983 CB 1100 made 108 hp our CB 1100 makes only 88 both 4 cyls.

divide an 88 hp 4 cyl into 4ths and you get 22 hp per cyl

divide 88 hp 4 cyl by 2 and you get 44 hp

so both the H'ness and the CB 350K both are basically close to the same power as our CB 1100's per cylinder
Mmm, OK. Not sure I like the cylinder comparison argument but I see what you are getting at.

My comment was not a criticism at Honda, just a comparison of what manufacturers have to do to meet emission regs then and now. The key to engine efficiency is being able to run at high compression ratios (CR). These small capacity air-cooled bikes just cannot run high CR and meet emission regs with their required tolerances. Just look at the great power coming out of the new RE450 motors and the Triumph 400's. Their water jacket allows them tight tolerances curbing those emissions and allows them to extract that much more power.

I've always equated these modern air-cooled 350's in my mind to an old mates Suzuki SB200, a great little 2-stroke. Similar 18-20HP but at a nifty 255lbs Vs a RE350 at around 398lbs. Given the choice I'd take that SB200 any day but then give it to a buddy to ride so I could ride behind it and smell that exhaust!

 

[alprider]

Emission regulations

thats it over and amen.........

--------------------------------------------------------
personal

and power is not all ""for me"" of this world.......I am not a convinced 125 rider for nothing...the way I drive and where I drive I no longer need power in addition
now this GB i look it as a fine tuned 125....thats it.....end

 

[peterbaron]

Alp, is your yellow CB1100 already traded in for the CB350?

 

[alprider]

not yet.....my dealer makes this week snow-holiday in our mountains......

I wanted to go for a farewell ride anyway, but we have cold winter weather......and I still have work

 

[the Ferret]

They most likely will not even bring it here.

 

[pekingduck]

I love singles, and I hope they do bring it here. I'd definitely be an owner. It's a niche American Honda has largely ignored. 21 hp is on par with the Royal Enfield Continental GT 500 that was not a rocket but was well received.

I've had a couple Suzuki singles, a TU250X that I put Triumph badges and lights and muffler on, and a 650 Savage that I turned into a street scrambler, and both were blasts to build and ride.

 

[peterbaron]

Beautiful bikes, thanks for sharing.

 

[alprider]

yesterday the frist bigger loop ca 2-300km

 

[Ollie]

The GB350 would be fun as a true retro street single. Air cooled, 2V, 70mm bore with a long 90mm stroke, heavy flywheel, and Honda made-in-Japan quality, at a very affordable price. It'll hit 80 mph so fast enough for brief stints on the Interstate to get on the next 2-lane highway. I like it!

OTOH it appears we'll get the GB500 version which will probably be nothing more than a retro styled SCL500 twin with its boring 180 degree motor.

 

[Gone in 60]

I really enjoyed my CB300R while I had it, but came to the realization that a single just isn't practical when you need freeways to get anywhere. Still, on Tuesday, I was headed to my new office which is a long slog on a fast highway with minimal traffic, doing 75 on my Bonneville when I was passed by what I thought was a newer Bonneville based on the looks, going 80, either a Street Twin 900 or maybe a 1200 T120. The rider gave me a wave as he passed. Later on, I caught up with him on a grade, tucked in about 15 feet behind a semi truck. I thought "Wow, that's really dangerous!" As I passed him, I realized he was on a newer Speed 400. Rather brave!

 

[alprider]

well she makes without problems 100km/h (60ml) or topspeed 114km/h (70ml)...is absolut enough for any minutes.....

and in my hands here she wants 2.5l per 100km...honda says it has 15l tank...but i guess its more like 17.5......


today :

 

[alprider]

spring feelings.......and already some over 3000km.....

 

[the Ferret]

So Alprider are you happy with the little single or do you find it "lacking"

 

[alprider]

no lack.................still a large smile under the helmet.....

 

[alprider]

eastern loop

 

[peterbaron]

This bike seems to have Michelin Pilot Road tires???