Feasibility of a Modern CB750

[Stichill]

In the wake of Motus’s demise, I saw this comment in reaction to the Revzilla story about the end of Motus:

“Have Honda build a CB750 styled like its CB1100, give it a fuel injected inline 4 with about 90 horsepower and sell it for between $7500 and $8500. Keep weight to no more than 450 lbs and make it devoid of electronic gadgetry.”

Obviously it would have to be liquid cooled, but other than that compromise...reaction?


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[LongRanger_imp]

I'd be a skeptic. 750's are considered "girl's bikes" these days. Even our F800GT's, which have the same 90-ish hp, were poor selling bikes due in part to their perceived anemic performance (which I disagree with) and perceived high price (disagree again). How has the latest Kawasaki ZX7-whatever naked bike fared in the US? I've never seen one.

I think the CB750 ship has sailed. It was the performance king until the Z1 appeared in 1973. I'm not sure what it would represent today. A Nighthawk redo?

 

[the Ferret]

Couple things IMO

(1) We are talking Honda...

They are not going to build an air cooled 750 with more horsepower than the 1100, and a liquid cooled 750 would have to be a revver to hit 90 hp

(2) We are talking Honda

They are not going to make a 750 4 cyclinder that weighs less than 500 pounds

(3) We are talking Honda

THey are not going to produce a 4 cyl 750 to retail less than their NC700 Twins

( 4) We are talking Honda

Even if they did do all of the above things, it would be so refined that the word on the street would be it had no character, that it was like a sewing machine, and it would be boring

(5) We are talking Honda...

There is no way the styling could make enough people happy.. Some would want retro, some would want neo- retro and some would want fresh and stylistic

 

[Stichill]

I’m not sure buyers (especially younger buyers under 30) are thumbs-down on 700cc-class bikes as much as they are thumbs-down on $10k-plus bikes generally.

I’m thinking this modern CB750 concept could be Honda’s answer to the Yamaha XSR700.

Product Lineup | Yamaha Motorsports, USA


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[the Ferret]

But that's a twin with 75 hp

Honda could probably do that given the above parameters, but again doubt that they would. They are happy with their NC750 platform. Slightly less horsepower, easier to ride and live with.

 

[Stichill]

In the glory days, wasn’t Yamaha kind of known for twins (e.g. XS650) and Honda for I4s? All before my time (motorcycle interest-wise).


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[the Ferret]

Lol right in my time

Honda was the leader in 4 stroke cylinder mltiplication which they developed in road racing

yamahas heritage was in small 2 stroke twins

YAmaha did have the 650 twin ( TX/XS series.. i had 3 of them) but they were Magura 650 clones which was the clones of the A7 BSA. They later developed the TX twins 500 and 750 which were their own design with counter balancers, but then went the triple route with the xs 750/850 then a big 1100 4 with the xs 1100

Yamaha did make an Seca 650/750 4 cylinders now that I think about it, but its hard to say Yamaha specialized in twins and Honda in 1-4's. During the mid 70s to mid 80s all the mfgs were producing motorcycles of all configurations at a crazy rate

 

[Roper_imp]

In the wake of Motus’s demise, I saw this comment in reaction to the Revzilla story about the end of Motus:

“Have Honda build a CB750 styled like its CB1100, give it a fuel injected inline 4 with about 90 horsepower and sell it for between $7500 and $8500. Keep weight to no more than 450 lbs and make it devoid of electronic gadgetry.”

Obviously it would have to be liquid cooled, but other than that compromise...reaction?


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It pretty much already exists.

Current CB650F: Liquid cooled I-4, 86hp, 454 lbs, base MSRP $8249. Only difference is more modern than retro style.

 

[LongRanger_imp]

^ Yep. There you go.

 

[Guth_imp]

You lost me at “water-cooled”. If it’s going to be water cooled then I’d rather just go with the modern standard CB650F and all of the other advances it brings.


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[Bheezy27403_imp]

Hmmm. I don't hate that 650. Anybody been on one? Don't like the water cooled but may be a fun little scoot. Especially since it seems they'll never bring the CB400 over here.

 

[jtopiso_imp]

Hmmm. I don't hate that 650. Anybody been on one? Don't like the water cooled but may be a fun little scoot. Especially since it seems they'll never bring the CB400 over here.

The CBF600 looked much better. I don't know if it ever arrived at the US.

http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Honda/honda_cbf600N 10.htm

It's like a detuned version of a Hornet.

When they moved the F from CBFxxx to CBxxxF, the classic looks were gone.

 

[Houtman_imp]

Hmmm. I don't hate that 650. Anybody been on one? Don't like the water cooled but may be a fun little scoot. Especially since it seems they'll never bring the CB400 over here.

The CBF600 looked much better. I don't know if it ever arrived at the US.

http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Honda/honda_cbf600N 10.htm

It's like a detuned version of a Hornet.

When they moved the F from CBFxxx to CBxxxF, the classic looks were gone.

The CBF600 looked much better. I don't know if it ever arrived at the US.

http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Honda/honda_cbf600N 10.htm

It's like a detuned version of a Hornet.

When they moved the F from CBFxxx to CBxxxF, the classic looks were gone.
That is a great looking bike !

 

[Henrik_imp]

I'm pretty sure the CB650 will be changed for next year to look like the CB1000R. They have done the transformation for the rest of their range already, and it is only the 500 and the 650 that remains to be changed.

 

[Bheezy27403_imp]

Hmmm. I don't hate that 650. Anybody been on one? Don't like the water cooled but may be a fun little scoot. Especially since it seems they'll never bring the CB400 over here.

The CBF600 looked much better. I don't know if it ever arrived at the US.

http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Honda/honda_cbf600N 10.htm

It's like a detuned version of a Hornet.

When they moved the F from CBFxxx to CBxxxF, the classic looks were gone.

The CBF600 looked much better. I don't know if it ever arrived at the US.

http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Honda/honda_cbf600N 10.htm

It's like a detuned version of a Hornet.

When they moved the F from CBFxxx to CBxxxF, the classic looks were gone.
That is a great looking bike !

The CBF600 looked much better. I don't know if it ever arrived at the US.

http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Honda/honda_cbf600N 10.htm

It's like a detuned version of a Hornet.

When they moved the F from CBFxxx to CBxxxF, the classic looks were gone.
That is a great looking bike !
Yup. Looks a lot like the 400. Stupid oceans.

 

[cooldrum_imp]

Well, I guess I have the best of both worlds. I ride a 1974 CB750K4 all stock with the 4 into 4 pipes and in contrast a 2013 CB1100. I really enjoy riding both bikes. Similar engine architecture and both motors have that linear engine feel. You can feel the 40 years of technology in both engine design and braking efficiency. Riding one makes you appreciate the other and on the 750 you just have to plan ahead when using the brakes. Also, that single overhead cam motor on the 750 has such a distinctive exhaust note. For those of us who've been around 750's, you just know.
I'm still impressed with the Honda engineering of these two models. The benchmark of an in-line four will be around for decades to come.

 

[Cormanus]

Given apparent sales of the CB1100 I'm not sure why Honda would roll out another retro machine. It's a dilemma for manufacturers of any kind, I guess. There are those of us who hanker for the looks of the past, while being grateful for updated fuelling, brakes, handling and the like, but many more, I suspect, want to take on more of the benefits of developments in technology. I don't know for sure, but I suspect all that plastic, water cooling, electronics and the produces a better and possibly safer machine that simply has a wider appeal. Sad? Maybe, but inevitable.

 

[LongRanger_imp]

I don't know if it's as much the benefits of new technology as it is the styling. Today's new riders have no connection to the UJM's of the past. Instead, they're likely more influenced by today's designs.

As a new rider / driver growing up in the 60's, I had zero interest in the hot rods and motorcycles of the 30's / 40's / 50's. I wanted the current stuff. Back then, the styling of the CB750 was groundbreaking and very appealing. Those old '50's BMW's, Triumph's, Harley's and Moto Guzzi's? Too heavy and frumpy. Yuck!

So, perhaps today's new rider views a '70's or '80's superbike the same way. We may love those bikes, but today's kids didn't grow up coveting one, the bikes have dated technology and performance, and the colors are garish compared to today's matte and/or blacked-out finishes. Why would a CB750 redo hold any appeal to them?

 

[rotor]

Hmmm. I don't hate that 650. Anybody been on one? Don't like the water cooled but may be a fun little scoot. Especially since it seems they'll never bring the CB400 over here.

to each it's on. What is to some a "fun little scoot" is to others the bike they woud take (solo) to Patagonia, much sooner that one of the curent touring mastodons.

If only it wasnt so ugly...

 

[dbarkdoll_imp]

I don't know if it's as much the benefits of new technology as it is the styling. Today's new riders have no connection to the UJM's of the past. Instead, they're likely more influenced by today's designs.

As a new rider / driver growing up in the 60's, I had zero interest in the hot rods and motorcycles of the 30's / 40's / 50's. I wanted the current stuff. Back then, the styling of the CB750 was groundbreaking and very appealing. Those old '50's BMW's, Triumph's, Harley's and Moto Guzzi's? Too heavy and frumpy. Yuck!

So, perhaps today's new rider views a '70's or '80's superbike the same way. We may love those bikes, but today's kids didn't grow up coveting one, the bikes have dated technology and performance, and the colors are garish compared to today's matte and/or blacked-out finishes. Why would a CB750 redo hold any appeal to them?

^ Bingo.