Check engine light/codes

[Carguy1959_imp]

Does anybody know how to read/find codes for reading the check engine light. My bike has been starting hard lately and this morning it bucked and the check engine light came on and stayed on all the way to work. I have replaced the spark plugs, battery, checked/cleaned the air filter, oil is fine. Bike has 6300 miles . Rode daily. Mostly highway. No mods to drive train. I did open up the stock muffler. I had also bought a next to new muffler and put it on 6 mo's ago. My 09 Harley FXDL did the same thing and it was the crank position sensor.
Any clues?

 

[Cormanus]

Carguy, as in so many matters technical, popgun may well be your man. I'm sure he owns a cable and bit of software he got from Healtech that allows him to interrogate the ECU. It plugs into a red plug under the left side cover. I'll see if I can find the thread.

Edit: Here you go. It's probably only a little bit of help, but there is a link to the Healtech site, http://cb1100forum.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=8666
By the way, Carguy, the user manual warns against riding the bike when the PGM-FI light is on other than at start up. It says, "reduce speed and take the motorcycle to your Honda dealer as soon as possible."

 

[curlyjoe]

On page 5-10 of the '13 service manual there is a method for determining the main Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) by observing the Malfunction Indicator Light (MIL) blinking pattern. This will only give you the main DTC code, not the subcode. On page 5-12 of the '13 service manual there is a table of DTC codes and equivalent MIL blinking number.

If there is a DTC stored in the ECM, there should be a MIL blinking pattern that will allow you to determine the main DTC code.

With the side stand down, turn on the ignition and see if the MIL starts blinking. You can also have the engine idling but the side stand must be down. If the engine RPM is over 1700, then the MIL stays on and does not blink. If there is no MIL blink pattern then there is no DTC error code stored in the ECM.

short blinks last 0.5 seconds and long blinks last 1.3 seconds. One long blink is equivalent to 10 short blinks.

One short blink is equivalent to DTC main code 1.1
9 short blinks is quivalent to DTC main code 9.1
One long blink and 2 short blinks is DTC main code 12.1 (one long blink = 10 short blinks so 10+2 short blinks = 12)

I can post a picture of the DTC index on page 5-12 of the '13 service manual if the moderators say it is ok.

 

[DaSwami_imp]

Does anybody know how to read/find codes for reading the check engine light. My bike has been starting hard lately and this morning it bucked and the check engine light came on and stayed on all the way to work. I have replaced the spark plugs, battery, checked/cleaned the air filter, oil is fine. Bike has 6300 miles . Rode daily. Mostly highway. No mods to drive train. I did open up the stock muffler. I had also bought a next to new muffler and put it on 6 mo's ago. My 09 Harley FXDL did the same thing and it was the crank position sensor.
Any clues?

Well that stinks.....best of luck and let us know what you find out, please. 2013 or 2014 bike?

 

[Lord Popgun]

I'm out of town right now, but brought the '13/14 manual for just these occasions

What Curly typed is the same for the '14's

You may have multiple codes stored too. If you post your code or codes, Curly or I can tell you what it is.

 

[Cormanus]

On page 5-10 of the '13 service manual there is a method for determining the main Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) by observing the Malfunction Indicator Light (MIL) blinking pattern. This will only give you the main DTC code, not the subcode. On page 5-12 of the '13 service manual there is a table of DTC codes and equivalent MIL blinking number.

If there is a DTC stored in the ECM, there should be a MIL blinking pattern that will allow you to determine the main DTC code.

With the side stand down, turn on the ignition and see if the MIL starts blinking. You can also have the engine idling but the side stand must be down. If the engine RPM is over 1700, then the MIL stays on and does not blink. If there is no MIL blink pattern then there is no DTC error code stored in the ECM.

short blinks last 0.5 seconds and long blinks last 1.3 seconds. One long blink is equivalent to 10 short blinks.

One short blink is equivalent to DTC main code 1.1
9 short blinks is quivalent to DTC main code 9.1
One long blink and 2 short blinks is DTC main code 12.1 (one long blink = 10 short blinks so 10+2 short blinks = 12)

I can post a picture of the DTC index on page 5-12 of the '13 service manual if the moderators say it is ok.

Apologies, but please don't.

 

[Lord Popgun]

If you need them Carguy, PM me your phone # and I'll take a pic and text it to you.

 

[Carguy1959_imp]

Thanks for the info. I have a 13-14 manual. My manual has the directions on 5-12 and 5-13. I will check them tomorrow.

 

[Cormanus]

Be interested to hear what it is, Carguy.

 

[Carguy1959_imp]

So, I did what it said, short the green and brown wires in the red 4 wire harness. Turn on fuel, turn on key, the light comes on .3 seconds and then blinks 8 slow blinks and 5 fast blinks. There doesn't seem to be a code in my book for 8-5. I checked the blinks about 20 times, justsayin.

 

[pekingduck]

There are 2 ways to retrieve DTCs. The dealer uses a laptop interface to read the exact code, (8-2 for example, for TPS high voltage test).
We count blinks, which gives a simple code (8 for example, which means the TPS is the problem area), and we do all the troubleshooting that starts with 8.

On the DTC Index page (5-12 of the 2013 Manual) the first column lists the DTC as a code with a dash between, followed by the simple code's number in parenthesis.

The long flash has a value of 10, so 8 long flashes is 80, and short flashes have a value of 1, so 5 short flashes is 5, for a simple code 85. It is not 8-5.

Now, there is no diagnosis for code 85 listed, but that doesn't mean it is not a code 85. The ECM is a computer and the troubleshooting listed is for normally expected failures in the US market. Aftermarket accessories such as HID or LED headlights and tracking devices have been known to cause problems. And like any computer, you may have a random unexpected glitch that no one can explain or re-create.

I'm curious if there are any aftermarket accessories, or other modifications installed, or a gas fill-up before the problem started. Next thing I would do is siphon the gas out and fill it with fresh juice. Then take it to a dealer. Your bike has a 5 year, 18,641 mile emissions warranty, if it has not been tampered with and has no accessories that may affect it, and this certainly sounds like it is not mechanical. If you can record the code on video, the dealer may need it for diagnosis.

 

[Lord Popgun]

Shorting the terminals and reading the blinks reads the stored code.

If you do not short the terminals you read the current code. What does it read? See page 5-13, and the DTC READOUT paragraph.

 

[Carguy1959_imp]

I had no current codes only the stored one. I have reset the ECM and will see if it returns. When the light came on, the bike was still cold, less than 3 minutes run time. I did take off rather quickly, shifting at about 6500 rpms. I ride to work most every day and fill up at least 2 times a week and only when it starts counting down miles to go. I only gas up at 2 different stations, both are newer. The only other mods on my bike are the Windjammer fairing and I wrapped my pipes with header wrap all the way to the end of the cat. It still sometimes cranks hard cold or hot. I replaced the battery with a new cheap one that had the same cold cranking amps of the orginal one. Charging system is working fine, 14+ volts when rev'd. I live in the Deep South (Mobile AL) lots of moisture and humidity. My bike is garage kept and kept clean. Maybe some of this info might be helpful.
Also popgun, I use to live in the tide water area. My brother lives in Aragona village, off the Blvd, behind Food Lion by Pembroke mall.
Thanks for the replies.

 

[Lord Popgun]

Maybe it just logged a transient error or the ECU just hicupped. No code now is obviously a good thing.

Although there is no 85 code listed, there is a code 86 but it is for the serial communication bus. The '13s do not have that though.

Hard to crank? You mean the starter is not spinning full speed? Or hard to start (engine won't fire up)?

 

[Carguy1959_imp]

Hard to crank, my bike is a 14STD. It will crank hard, let off button and then crank normal. I checked all connections no change. I may have to brake down and buy a higher CCA battery. Batteries plus has one for around $110 and I think it is a lithium battery.

 

[Lord Popgun]

OK, sorry. For some reason I though it was a '13.

In any case, for hard cranking, I would normally go with battery and connections. If all good, then the starter relay could be the problem. Relays will act like that when the contacts get burned or pitted, etc.

Remember to check the starter ground cable connection too. Shown on page 18-8 in the '14 manual.

The circuit is fairly simple so if it isn't the battery it should be easy to trace it down.

 

[PowerDubs_imp]

Just saw this as I am looking to figure out the MIL / CEL I just conjured with my fiddling might be-


Not that it is relevant to me, but I always like an end to the story- what happened?

 

[itstuantran_imp]

You should think of the malfunctioned O2 sensor. That's the most common possibility for check engine light to come on. A diagnostics would provide precise result though. Mine had the same symptom and had to replace the one on the left (RS 17 has 2 sensors)