Yep. Great link, WD.
BMW makes a Maintenance Free Chain
- Thread starter cbolling_imp
- Start date
Django
Road warrior
Hovmod_imp
Running like a top
Uh...
Don't interpret this to imply that I don't appreciate a good pun, I am a dad, after all, but can we talk more about these maintenance free chains? Do we trust them? I know about all the pros of chains vs shaft drives, but darn, that detail was always one of my favorite things about my BMW back in the day. I would happily sacrifice a couple HP for the bliss of never having to (over-)lube my chain.
Are we laughing at it, or are we ordering them?
Don't interpret this to imply that I don't appreciate a good pun, I am a dad, after all, but can we talk more about these maintenance free chains? Do we trust them? I know about all the pros of chains vs shaft drives, but darn, that detail was always one of my favorite things about my BMW back in the day. I would happily sacrifice a couple HP for the bliss of never having to (over-)lube my chain.
Are we laughing at it, or are we ordering them?
cbolling_imp
First service completed
Thread starter
I almost ended up with a Motto Guzzi V7 instead of my CB1100 solely based on the fact that it has a shaft drive instead of a Chain.
Houtman_imp
Road warrior
I for one prefer the simplicity of todays high quality chains over shaft drives.
pekingduck
Road warrior
Aside from the minor HP loss, there is also added sprung weight, expense and complexity.Hovmod_imp said:
I'm not a fan of all shaft drive systems. Some are more complex and tend to require more maintenance, like those made in Bavaria. In addition to the normal lubing of the axle shaft splines, you have potential driveshaft housing and final drive leaks, torn boots, and lubing input shaft spline lubes. Just for reference, a Gold Wing driveshaft is $348, a BMW one is $1212.
I haven't found drive chain maintenance to be an issue with good quality (Japanese made) o-ring or x-ring chains. I may need to adjust once, lube it 2-3 times, before the tire gets replaced. But this is in the relatively dry Southwest, and none of my bikes exceeds 100hp. I'm sure wetter climates will require more maintenance.
The greatest harm may come from pressure washing or scrubbing chains.
Gone in 60
Road warrior
When I owned my last BMW, an '07, that model was experiencing a rash of driveline failures. I think I was more worried about having my final drive grenade itself than I am about any chain I've ever ridden on. Never had that worry on any of my Honda shaft drive bikes.
Oh, and Franco Nero was my favorite Django (current company excepted, of course)
Oh, and Franco Nero was my favorite Django (current company excepted, of course)
redbirds_imp
Road warrior
A maintenance free chain would be nice but what's the price. Far more than a conventional chain I'll wager.
My last shaft drive bike was a Guzzi with the CARC system and it was a pain; leaking gear oil without warning. After cleaning and inspection it might be fine for a month and then happen again. Modern chains are so good, needing little adjustment and just an occasional clean and lube. Durable, simple and reliable.
My last shaft drive bike was a Guzzi with the CARC system and it was a pain; leaking gear oil without warning. After cleaning and inspection it might be fine for a month and then happen again. Modern chains are so good, needing little adjustment and just an occasional clean and lube. Durable, simple and reliable.
Bheezy27403_imp
Road warrior
100% agree. I've never had a chain (or sprocket) break or fail and believe me I do not waste my time fussing with them. Clean and lube maybe twice a year. They are cheap to replace. You can keep your shaft drive, I'll keep my chains thank you very much.
the Ferret
Road warrior
I prefer shafts. A chain and sprocket set lasts me about 30,000 miles on average. The last set on my CB went 36,909 miles and cost $400 to replace parts and labor. The shaft on my ST 1300 was still in perfect working order at 110,000 miles when I sold the bike and required about $7 of fluid per year plus a little moly lube on the splines once a year. That would have been about 4 sets of chains and sprockets or about $1600 parts and labor. The shaft on my FJR 1300 has gone 32,000 miles in 2 years and again has used a few ounces of fluid twice a year. If it were chains and sprockets it would be coming up on a $400 bill soon.
My opinion..and only my opinion..is chains and sprockets are ok if you don't ride very much. For the average rider who does less than 5,000 miles a year, a chain and sprocket set will last you approximately 7 years. If you tend to put a lot of miles on, ride long distances, those that ride 20-25,000 miles a year, a chain and sprocket set won't make 18 months. For those riders, a shaft drive is a far better system. It's not maintenance free, but it's close, and other than some BMW failures (reportedly only 5% of BMW shaft drive bikes) they have proven to be very durable systems. There is a reason nearly all touring bikes come with shaft drive..and ALL cars and trucks.
Who here would buy a chain drive car?.... raise your hands (btw Honda used to make one)
My opinion..and only my opinion..is chains and sprockets are ok if you don't ride very much. For the average rider who does less than 5,000 miles a year, a chain and sprocket set will last you approximately 7 years. If you tend to put a lot of miles on, ride long distances, those that ride 20-25,000 miles a year, a chain and sprocket set won't make 18 months. For those riders, a shaft drive is a far better system. It's not maintenance free, but it's close, and other than some BMW failures (reportedly only 5% of BMW shaft drive bikes) they have proven to be very durable systems. There is a reason nearly all touring bikes come with shaft drive..and ALL cars and trucks.
Who here would buy a chain drive car?.... raise your hands (btw Honda used to make one)
pekingduck
Road warrior
I would expect any Japanese shaft/final drive to work properly, with little or no problem for at least 100k miles, and I have no qualms about them.
But 5% of BMWs, 1 in 20, is a pretty high percentage, even assuming a higher mileage accumulation. Certainly not what would be car-like reliability.
Back in my dealership days, I'd see rear sprocket teeth worn, folded over so the tips were almost touching, with red iron oxide powder caked and dusted under the countershaft sprocket cover. On street bikes, ridden in, the clueless owner usually complaining the clutch has been slipping.
On one, the front sprocket was spinning after it had hammered and eroded the splines on the countershaft itself. We arc-weld the sprocket to the shaft. My point is that chains can take a lot of abuse/neglect and the failure is not sudden or completely debilitating.
But 5% of BMWs, 1 in 20, is a pretty high percentage, even assuming a higher mileage accumulation. Certainly not what would be car-like reliability.
Back in my dealership days, I'd see rear sprocket teeth worn, folded over so the tips were almost touching, with red iron oxide powder caked and dusted under the countershaft sprocket cover. On street bikes, ridden in, the clueless owner usually complaining the clutch has been slipping.
On one, the front sprocket was spinning after it had hammered and eroded the splines on the countershaft itself. We arc-weld the sprocket to the shaft. My point is that chains can take a lot of abuse/neglect and the failure is not sudden or completely debilitating.
the Ferret
Road warrior
I've seen that too, during my 17 years in the motorcycle industry.pekingduck_imp said:
Also saw quite a few bikes with broken chains wadded up around the counter sprocket with a hole punched in the engine cases, which WAS certainly sudden and completely debilitating
Never seen that happen on a shaft drive bike.
