Need advice on CB1100 and other

[foxinsuit_imp]

I currently own both a CB1100 and a ZRX1200. Both are excellent bikes.

But I am firmly in the camp that both are also too much bike for a beginner.

Honestly you can hurt yourself on anything, even a SV650 can wheelie when provoked without much issue.

Start smaller, cheaper, lighter, safer. Enjoy the ride itself, don't focus on power or acceleration. You will be too busy focusing on cars and deer.

I am currently looking at a Zephyr 750. Pictures of it are a few posts above.

Don't rely on driving experience, it will not matter much when it comes to riding. Even 8 years of driving experience in a car is not that much. Start smaller and buy a cheap bike. You will thank us in the end if you ever have an incident. Plus if you can't afford a cb1100 than you should really be looking at something small and cheap. The cb1100 is actually one of the more affordable bikes when your ready for that. Your need to grow with experience not only with riding but remember their will be other expenses besides the bike when it comes to riding, like tires, maintenance, gear, insurance, fuel and so on. Grow financially as well by saving for the bigger bike as you learn on the smaller cheaper one and remember how you drive your car will not compare at all to riding a motorcycle.

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I understand all the concern of the beginner getting a big bike. However I stated that I'm not buying CB11 now, because it's too expensive for me at the time. But not because it's too big. I completely agree that ZRX1200 is too big, that for example XJR1300 is too big, that GSX1400 is too big, that CB1300 is too big, bandit 1250 is too big, but I don't feel that way about honda at all. I know it's too much anyway for a beginner, but if I had a chance to own it I wouldn't hesitate one second. With the other mentioned BIG BIKES, most of which I can afford to buy right now, I hesitate if it's the right choice due to their big size and power.

Sure, I'd like to start on something smaller, but those smaller less powerfull bikes that I like the design of are moto guzzi v7, kawasaki W800 or bonneville and they are still very expensive despite some of them being quite an old age.
I don't think any of these smaller bikes are worth the asking price which is like 70-110% price of the CB1100,

I agree with these comments. Starting with a smaller, lightweight bike will allow your skills to develop and progress more rapidly than on a larger bike. With increased skills comes increased confidence and enjoyment.

Your generalization "those same narrow tires requires to be more careful on twisties as I understand due to their smaller surface area" is false. The narrow tires make the bike more agile and easier to handle.

With wider tires,
1. You'll be able to brake or accelerate much harder without losing grip
2. Steering will feel heavier
3. Bike won't "fall into" corners as easily
4. It'll be easier to maintain your turning line, but harder to change it
5. Tires will last longer
6. The tires will be more prone to hydroplaning

Grip is independent of surface area of contact (before you factor in the difference due to change in temperatures from rolling resistance and the strength of the rubber), but a narrower tire will wear faster trying to provide the same amount of grip. A wider tire on the other hand, will offer the benefits of longevity with increased grip, but make the handing sluggish.

Thanks for these explanations.
Again I am looking at a smaller, cheaper and less powerful bike right now Zephyr 750. If the deal goes down I think I'll be happy with it. Looks of the motorcycle are very important. From a technical perspective there are great bikes on the market, however non of them would put a smile on my face from a simple observation. Zephyr 750 fits that category.

If I won't be able to buy it then who knows. Riding season is comming to an end where I live, so I'll probably be waiting for spring.

[PowerDubs_imp]

Zephyr is too big, and still too powerful unless you are a conservative timid person. The problem is, the type if people who tend to disregard, disagree and still buy a non appropriate bike to learn on tend to be more agressive based on the very same traits that make them ignore our advice.

It's no mistake that us older riders advise what we do- it's called experience and been there done that. Too many close calls and mistakes by ourselves or friends.

Time will pass quick enough, don't rush, start on a small bike.


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[postoak_imp]

One thing that can get a beginner in trouble is a twitchy throttle, and one thing I've just learned recently is that fuel-injected bikes (at least in the EPA-controlled U.S.) are bad about having twitchy throttles. So, that's a good reason to look at an older carbureted bike. That, and you seem to think you have some mechanical abilities, so that you can rebuild the carbs on any bike you buy if they start not to perform well. (Plus, you'll have 8 months of non-riding season to do so!)

I started on a 495 pound 750cc bike, and didn't find it hard to handle.

[Cormanus]

There's a danger in the back-in-the-day approach to advice. Of course things were better back then because our view of them is coloured by subsequent experience.

When I started out riding on a Honda CB175, a CB350 was a large bike and the recently released CB750-4 was unimaginably larger and more powerful. I was a beast to be aspired to after several years riding experience. It simply wasn't the sort of thing a sensible person would take on without time on a more modest machine under her or his belt. I think that was the right approach. A 750cc motorcycle is still a large beast to start out on and I'd recommend something smaller.

Having said all that, there's a number of members here who think the CB1100 is just fine as a first motorcycle. Who am I to argue? many of them have ridden a great deal more than I have.

So, if the Zephyr 750 lights your fire, buy it and enjoy it. Just be careful until you figure out just how much power it has.

[Wisedrum]

Even a powerful motorbike is not fast by itself.
It's the rider, who makes it fast.
He has it in his hand and even more
in his mind, to let it run the way he and
his ability can adequately adjust to the machine.

That goes for every bike, even the most
powerful ones, which can run like peaceful lamps
or aggressive tigers. But it takes some time
and even more experience to develop this kind of mindset, without beeing tempted by what others do.

A powerful bike offers a great chance
to become reckless. It's a healthy art to resist.

Wisedrum

[redbirds_imp]

Even a powerful motorbike is not fast by itself.
It's the rider, who makes it fast.
He has it in his hand and even more
in his mind, to let it run the way he and
his ability can adequately adjust to the machine.

That goes for every bike, even the most
powerful ones, which can run like peaceful lamps
or aggressive tigers. But it takes some time
and even more experience to develop this kind of mindset, without beeing tempted by what others do.

A powerful bike offers a great chance
to become reckless. It's a healthy art to resist.

Wisedrum

Yes, well said.

[postoak_imp]

Cormanus, your post reminds me back in the day people talked about the Triumph 750 as if it some sort of monster machine. When I finally got into motorcycling decades later, I remember thinking "this is what my friends were talking about as being so powerful -- this?!?".
And I still say the one thing that can get you into trouble is a twitchy throttle. Yes, you can drive a powerful bike very sedately, but go over a bump that makes you jerk the throttle and you can get in trouble. Part of becoming an experienced rider is knowing how to not freak out when that happens, and to instinctively do the correct thing. But "instinct" isn't quite the right word since this isn't something inbred -- it is a reaction based on thousands of hours of riding experience.

[foxinsuit_imp]

Zephyr is too big, and still too powerful unless you are a conservative timid person. The problem is, the type if people who tend to disregard, disagree and still buy a non appropriate bike to learn on tend to be more agressive based on the very same traits that make them ignore our advice.

It's no mistake that us older riders advise what we do- it's called experience and been there done that. Too many close calls and mistakes by ourselves or friends.

Time will pass quick enough, don't rush, start on a small bike.


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At motorcycle riding school I learned to ride on a ZR7 which is a successor to the ZEPHYR 750 which I am looking at. Also had a chance to try a ER6N 600-650cc whatever it was and it felt much weaker. I didn't like that aspect of the bike. But I got to admit it was easier to control than a ZR7.

Also I'm living in a light traffic suburbs and I'm thinking to just practice a lot until I decide to commute to work with a bike. Again I know how to ride. At least basics of it. I could ride to and from work if I wanted to the next day I buy a bike, but I'm not planning on doing so at all.
By the way I had to pass the exam riding in real traffic anyway so it's not like I haven't touched a bike.

I kind of keep feeling like a major A-hole for keeping arguing with all of you of what size of a bike I think is right for me

600cc ER6N - fits like glove - I felt extremely comfortable and in control.
But ZR7 was much more fun to ride, even if the max speed I reached (abiding the rules) was only 70kmph (44mph).

I don't get it why I should go with something more smaller on which I feel comfortable already if I can just practice a bit more and get on the same level of confidence on a 750cc bike within like a week of practice or maybe even less.

My lessons before the exam were about 10hours of motorcycle time total. 2hrs once a week or once every other week. And I rode the zr7 during the exam in real traffic with just 10hrs devided within 2months under my resume. Therefore I really don't think 750cc bile is too big for me.

[postoak_imp]

Your training is a lot more than we get over here that's for sure.

I think you'll be okay with a 500 pound or so bike, just not the CB1100 (or any sport or supersport).

Your riding season is about over anyway from what you say, why not wait for some deals?

[foxinsuit_imp]

One thing that can get a beginner in trouble is a twitchy throttle, and one thing I've just learned recently is that fuel-injected bikes (at least in the EPA-controlled U.S.) are bad about having twitchy throttles. So, that's a good reason to look at an older carbureted bike. That, and you seem to think you have some mechanical abilities, so that you can rebuild the carbs on any bike you buy if they start not to perform well. (Plus, you'll have 8 months of non-riding season to do so!)

I started on a 495 pound 750cc bike, and didn't find it hard to handle.

I don't have mechanical abilities. And initially I stayed away from carb bikes. But as time went on, I learnt that there's nothing to be afraid of really.
I read on forums, watched youtube videos on carb cleaning and even asked my dad who has much more experience and skills in technical department than me. He simply said it's a no big deal at all.

I'd like to believe that. After all CARBURATED bikes were manufactured for a long time.
Triumph bonneville if I'm not mistaken only started FUEL INJECTION since 2009. Yamaha XJR1300 since 2007 model. And most of the changes were made because of stricter polution requirements.

Would I like my bike to have FI - sure. But I learned not to discriminate carbs