Posts: 5,025
Threads: 136
Likes Received: 136 in 58 posts
Likes Given: 66
Joined: May 2013
Good points, Rotor. Terms are important, though. "formation riding" can mean different things to different people.
Riding in a staggered formation with 2 second spacing is perfectly safe and is probably safer for the riders. Riding either staggered, but with short gaps or side by side is fraught with peril. The key, to me at least, is that the riders in the group understand that they are responsible for their own safety and should view riding in a group no differently than if they just happened to be riding in traffic with a bunch of other bikes traveling at the same rate of speed. That means that a rider would let a motorist (or a motorcyclist) move in just as they would if they were riding solo. I have not seen many (I actually don't recall ever seeing this) drivers that move into the middle of a group ride just to be in that lane; they do it because they are about to exit or to get out of the way of faster moving traffic in the vacated lane. Most of the preceding pertains to riding on 4+ lane highways.
In response to your "question" -- They aren't always morons. If you're on a two-lane and you can't pass them all, I think you should wait until they turn off or until you can pass them all. I am 90% sure that it's technically illegal to pass more than one vehicle at a time in the opposite lane, so your other choice, I guess, is to make 20 passes. That seems more dangerous to both riders and driver than waiting patiently or passing the whole lot.
I'm skipping around here a lot, but I think most ride organizers, with the exception of those organizing charity rides, worry about the pack mentality and some of the other things that concern you. I see more and more where the ride organizer splits the large group into small groups of 5-10 riders.
Posts: 2,635
Threads: 125
Likes Received: 1 in 1 posts
Likes Given: 0
Joined: Jun 2016
I got pulled over by the MPs on base for swerving in my lane.
They let me go- but they weren't overly friendly.
Posts: 23,416
Threads: 697
Likes Received: 498 in 228 posts
Likes Given: 624
Joined: Apr 2025
(08-20-2018, 12:39 AM)misterprofessionality_imp Wrote: If loud pipes save lives then everybody on a Zero is dead meat....
Omg that's funny
At least here in Ohio, it's illegal to pass on a double line
It's illegal to pass more than one vehicle at a time. (If there are 20 of them, you might just as well pull over and wait, or pick a different direction)
It's illegal to pass a vehicle without signaling, either with a flashing headlight or horn beep that you are passing
It is also illegal to move over more than one lane at a time..as you see people getting on a freeway and then moving all the way across to the high speed lane in one fell swoop. Legally you have to take command of each lane and then signal and move to the next lane etc. until you get to the high speed lane
In most states it is illegal to run in the high speed lane without passing someone. It's posted in Kentucky (keep right except to pass) but not much in Ohio although it is still the law.
And one I learned the other day by asking a local leo.. The speed limit in an unmarked residential area is 45 mph ( there is a little town I ride thru regularly that has such a zone, but they wont post it so they can write up people going through there that don't know the law. ( I didn't so I saw an leo sitting there running radar and pulled over and asked him) I'm still trying to figure out how many residences it takes to be considered residential, because otherwise the speed limit is 55, but in a local town looking for revenue, that 10 mph can spell the difference between being pulled over or not.
Loud pipes and high bars are also illegal but they don't seem to get much attention around here.
Posts: 3,454
Threads: 129
Likes Received: 0 in 0 posts
Likes Given: 0
Joined: Jul 2015
One recent law I found interesting in California is that if your vehicle has turn signals, it's illegal to use hand signals. I guess it's because motorists could confuse or dismiss your hand signal as something else. In Colorado, there's no annual safety inspection and no requirement to even have turn signals.
Posts: 293
Threads: 17
Likes Received: 3 in 1 posts
Likes Given: 0
Joined: Mar 2015
"Group riding"
(08-20-2018, 05:25 AM)EmptySea_imp Wrote: Good points, Rotor. Terms are important, though. "formation riding" can mean different things to different people.
Riding in a staggered formation with 2 second spacing is perfectly safe and is probably safer for the riders. Riding either staggered, but with short gaps or side by side is fraught with peril. The key, to me at least, is that the riders in the group understand that they are responsible for their own safety and should view riding in a group no differently than if they just happened to be riding in traffic with a bunch of other bikes traveling at the same rate of speed. That means that a rider would let a motorist (or a motorcyclist) move in just as they would if they were riding solo. I have not seen many (I actually don't recall ever seeing this) drivers that move into the middle of a group ride just to be in that lane; they do it because they are about to exit or to get out of the way of faster moving traffic in the vacated lane. Most of the preceding pertains to riding on 4+ lane highways.
In response to your "question" -- They aren't always morons. If you're on a two-lane and you can't pass them all, I think you should wait until they turn off or until you can pass them all. I am 90% sure that it's technically illegal to pass more than one vehicle at a time in the opposite lane, so your other choice, I guess, is to make 20 passes. That seems more dangerous to both riders and driver than waiting patiently or passing the whole lot.
I'm skipping around here a lot, but I think most ride organizers, with the exception of those organizing charity rides, worry about the pack mentality and some of the other things that concern you. I see more and more where the ride organizer splits the large group into small groups of 5-10 riders. Of course not. I should pipe down a notch 
But to put it in cold, clinical terms:
Travelling in a group, so close to other participants that there is not enough room to overtake individual riders one by one (i.e., by "moving in" the group, to use the term of the original text) is illegal in most road traffic jurisdictions. What is the precise language in the laws and regulations in each of the Canadian provinces and States of the Union I do not know, but anybody with half a brain (in the clinical sense) probably understands that such behaviour is impacting other road users quite negatively, and should thus refrain from doing so.
"Group riding" - as described above - has been a regular feature of recreational motorcycling use in North America in the years and decades past. But the traffic is much heavier today than it was in the idyllic times when this behaviour was common and/or acceptable. It is exactly us, the motorcycling community, that must be the first to fight any behaviour that sheds bad light on all motorcyclists.
(My next post will thus be about those that compensate their lack of other manly attributes by modifying their motorcycle exhaust systems so that its excessive noise annoys the heck out of the general road user public. And I promise not to use the aforementioned objectionable term... 
Posts: 548
Threads: 18
Likes Received: 0 in 0 posts
Likes Given: 0
Joined: Apr 2017
(08-20-2018, 04:50 PM)rotor_imp Wrote: "Group riding"
(08-20-2018, 05:25 AM)EmptySea_imp Wrote: Good points, Rotor. Terms are important, though. "formation riding" can mean different things to different people.
Riding in a staggered formation with 2 second spacing is perfectly safe and is probably safer for the riders. Riding either staggered, but with short gaps or side by side is fraught with peril. The key, to me at least, is that the riders in the group understand that they are responsible for their own safety and should view riding in a group no differently than if they just happened to be riding in traffic with a bunch of other bikes traveling at the same rate of speed. That means that a rider would let a motorist (or a motorcyclist) move in just as they would if they were riding solo. I have not seen many (I actually don't recall ever seeing this) drivers that move into the middle of a group ride just to be in that lane; they do it because they are about to exit or to get out of the way of faster moving traffic in the vacated lane. Most of the preceding pertains to riding on 4+ lane highways.
In response to your "question" -- They aren't always morons. If you're on a two-lane and you can't pass them all, I think you should wait until they turn off or until you can pass them all. I am 90% sure that it's technically illegal to pass more than one vehicle at a time in the opposite lane, so your other choice, I guess, is to make 20 passes. That seems more dangerous to both riders and driver than waiting patiently or passing the whole lot.
I'm skipping around here a lot, but I think most ride organizers, with the exception of those organizing charity rides, worry about the pack mentality and some of the other things that concern you. I see more and more where the ride organizer splits the large group into small groups of 5-10 riders. Of course not. I should pipe down a notch
But to put it in cold, clinical terms:
Travelling in a group, so close to other participants that there is not enough room to overtake individual riders one by one (i.e., by "moving in" the group, to use the term of the original text) is illegal in most road traffic jurisdictions. What is the precise language in the laws and regulations in each of the Canadian provinces and States of the Union I do not know, but anybody with half a brain (in the clinical sense) probably understands that such behaviour is impacting other road users quite negatively, and should thus refrain from doing so.
"Group riding" - as described above - has been a regular feature of recreational motorcycling use in North America in the years and decades past. But the traffic is much heavier today than it was in the idyllic times when this behaviour was common and/or acceptable. It is exactly us, the motorcycling community, that must be the first to fight any behaviour that sheds bad light on all motorcyclists.
(My next post will thus be about those that compensate their lack of other manly attributes by modifying their motorcycle exhaust systems so that its excessive noise annoys the heck out of the general road user public. And I promise not to use the aforementioned objectionable term... Of course not. I should pipe down a notch
But to put it in cold, clinical terms:
Travelling in a group, so close to other participants that there is not enough room to overtake individual riders one by one (i.e., by "moving in" the group, to use the term of the original text) is illegal in most road traffic jurisdictions. What is the precise language in the laws and regulations in each of the Canadian provinces and States of the Union I do not know, but anybody with half a brain (in the clinical sense) probably understands that such behaviour is impacting other road users quite negatively, and should thus refrain from doing so.
"Group riding" - as described above - has been a regular feature of recreational motorcycling use in North America in the years and decades past. But the traffic is much heavier today than it was in the idyllic times when this behaviour was common and/or acceptable. It is exactly us, the motorcycling community, that must be the first to fight any behaviour that sheds bad light on all motorcyclists.
(My next post will thus be about those that compensate their lack of other manly attributes by modifying their motorcycle exhaust systems so that its excessive noise annoys the heck out of the general road user public. And I promise not to use the aforementioned objectionable term...
I am one of the unwashed masses that rides a Harley but I despise loud pipes, for the reason you mentioned - it annoys the general public and paints us in bad light. I bought the quietest aftermarket exhaust I could find, I used to leave for work at 5:45am, I'm sure my neighbours would have been thrilled with straight pipes. I even stopped riding with one guy because his exhaust was just stupid.
Posts: 2,590
Threads: 28
Likes Received: 6 in 2 posts
Likes Given: 0
Joined: Mar 2013
(08-20-2018, 07:51 PM)Banned_imp Wrote: (08-20-2018, 04:50 PM)rotor_imp Wrote: "Group riding"
(08-20-2018, 05:25 AM)EmptySea_imp Wrote: Good points, Rotor. Terms are important, though. "formation riding" can mean different things to different people.
Riding in a staggered formation with 2 second spacing is perfectly safe and is probably safer for the riders. Riding either staggered, but with short gaps or side by side is fraught with peril. The key, to me at least, is that the riders in the group understand that they are responsible for their own safety and should view riding in a group no differently than if they just happened to be riding in traffic with a bunch of other bikes traveling at the same rate of speed. That means that a rider would let a motorist (or a motorcyclist) move in just as they would if they were riding solo. I have not seen many (I actually don't recall ever seeing this) drivers that move into the middle of a group ride just to be in that lane; they do it because they are about to exit or to get out of the way of faster moving traffic in the vacated lane. Most of the preceding pertains to riding on 4+ lane highways.
In response to your "question" -- They aren't always morons. If you're on a two-lane and you can't pass them all, I think you should wait until they turn off or until you can pass them all. I am 90% sure that it's technically illegal to pass more than one vehicle at a time in the opposite lane, so your other choice, I guess, is to make 20 passes. That seems more dangerous to both riders and driver than waiting patiently or passing the whole lot.
I'm skipping around here a lot, but I think most ride organizers, with the exception of those organizing charity rides, worry about the pack mentality and some of the other things that concern you. I see more and more where the ride organizer splits the large group into small groups of 5-10 riders. Of course not. I should pipe down a notch
But to put it in cold, clinical terms:
Travelling in a group, so close to other participants that there is not enough room to overtake individual riders one by one (i.e., by "moving in" the group, to use the term of the original text) is illegal in most road traffic jurisdictions. What is the precise language in the laws and regulations in each of the Canadian provinces and States of the Union I do not know, but anybody with half a brain (in the clinical sense) probably understands that such behaviour is impacting other road users quite negatively, and should thus refrain from doing so.
"Group riding" - as described above - has been a regular feature of recreational motorcycling use in North America in the years and decades past. But the traffic is much heavier today than it was in the idyllic times when this behaviour was common and/or acceptable. It is exactly us, the motorcycling community, that must be the first to fight any behaviour that sheds bad light on all motorcyclists.
(My next post will thus be about those that compensate their lack of other manly attributes by modifying their motorcycle exhaust systems so that its excessive noise annoys the heck out of the general road user public. And I promise not to use the aforementioned objectionable term... Of course not. I should pipe down a notch
But to put it in cold, clinical terms:
Travelling in a group, so close to other participants that there is not enough room to overtake individual riders one by one (i.e., by "moving in" the group, to use the term of the original text) is illegal in most road traffic jurisdictions. What is the precise language in the laws and regulations in each of the Canadian provinces and States of the Union I do not know, but anybody with half a brain (in the clinical sense) probably understands that such behaviour is impacting other road users quite negatively, and should thus refrain from doing so.
"Group riding" - as described above - has been a regular feature of recreational motorcycling use in North America in the years and decades past. But the traffic is much heavier today than it was in the idyllic times when this behaviour was common and/or acceptable. It is exactly us, the motorcycling community, that must be the first to fight any behaviour that sheds bad light on all motorcyclists.
(My next post will thus be about those that compensate their lack of other manly attributes by modifying their motorcycle exhaust systems so that its excessive noise annoys the heck out of the general road user public. And I promise not to use the aforementioned objectionable term...
I am one of the unwashed masses that rides a Harley but I despise loud pipes, for the reason you mentioned - it annoys the general public and paints us in bad light. I bought the quietest aftermarket exhaust I could find, I used to leave for work at 5:45am, I'm sure my neighbours would have been thrilled with straight pipes. I even stopped riding with one guy because his exhaust was just stupid.
Haha! Me too. I was actually embarrassed to ride in public with a straight piped riding acquaintance. There I was on my virtually silent CB, getting angry looks from motorists and pedestrians wherever we went.
Posts: 517
Threads: 32
Likes Received: 0 in 0 posts
Likes Given: 0
Joined: Mar 2016
The original post was a thoughtful plea. However, the real audience is not the intended audience. The real audience consists of fellow motorcyclists, who are all nodding in agreement. The plea doesn't reach the ears of motorists who drive cars, trucks, tractor trailer rigs, etc. So nothing changes.
My years of riding have taught me that improving my safety will only come from me--not from laws and certainly not from other motorists. It would be nice if that wasn't the case, but it is. The only alternative is not to ride.
Posts: 352
Threads: 18
Likes Received: 0 in 0 posts
Likes Given: 0
Joined: Jul 2015
(08-20-2018, 04:43 AM)rotor_imp Wrote: (08-19-2018, 12:17 AM)dsan1964_imp Wrote: HOW TO UNDERSTAND A BIKER
When you see us moving past you quickly:
Don’t take offense or think we’re trying to "show off”.
Ninety five percent of the time,
we’re trying to get out of your blind spot or taking ourselves out of a potential dangerous situation that has evolved around us. Distancing ourselves from you does not mean we want to race, but that we’re giving ourselves the edge we need at the moment.
When you hear our horn:
Don’t take offense or think we’re trying to aggravate you. All we’re doing is letting you
know where we are in relation to you on the road, and we’re more than likely aware of your inattentiveness to us while you're talking/texting on a cell phone, eating, reading or involved in some other distracting aspect to your driving. It’s important to us, and you, that you know we’re there.
When you hear our loud pipes:
Don’t become angry and hostile toward us. Yes, some are quite loud, but for some, there’s a purpose behind being loud. It’s about letting you know we’re close by and we’re constantly hoping that our investment in this accessory will help save our lives. Our pipes are really not about our ego…it’s a pride and personalization to our form of transportation.
When you see us in our clothes:
Don’t become fearful of us or think us weird. Our leather jackets, chaps, gloves and
boots are the barriers between loosing massive amounts of flesh should something cause us to go down…nothing more, nothing less. Safety gear is paramount to our riding.
When you see aggressive riding bikers:
Don’t put us all in the same stereotypical category as those whose behavior and actions would cause you to react in disgust and intolerance. Many of us do not agree with this style of riding either, and we know and understand that human nature tends to blend us all together as the “same group”. Most of us don’t want that title…and don’t deserve it.
When you see a group of bikers on the roadways:
Give us the courtesy of sharing the road with you. Please don’t “move in” between several
bikers in formation. This gets us very excited and nervous, especially when it’s done with
no due regard for our safety.
Provide us with your awareness of the fact that we are much more vulnerable than you.
We don’t want to challenge you, for all of us are wise enough to know…we’d lose that battle.
When you are turning left or entering a roadway/highway:
Look, then look again…and then one more time. For we can be easily hidden, and appear to be invisible by such things as a
telephone pole, another vehicle, bright lights or the glare of the sun…or possibly, the beads hanging from your rearview mirror, among numerous other items that are displayed there. If you see us flashing our
lights at you or blowing our horn, we’re only trying to ensure that you will see us before tragedy changes both our lives.
When you are behind us:
Please give us the room we need and don’t tailgate us. If you hit us, we’re going down…
HARD! We don’t want to play games with you, we just want to enjoy the ride and the fresh air, and experience that which many of you have never lived for. If we accelerate
away from you, we're only trying to take ourselves out of a bad situation if you insist on being too close.
Thank You for attempting to understand.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
"Formation" motorcycle riding on a public roadway in a is an antiquated, sociopathic pack behavour. It is no longer tolerated on public roads outside of this continent.
Out of curiosity: what the heck is a car driver supposed to do in order to overtake a pack of twenty or so morons on a "group ride"? Drive patiently behind them until they choose to stop for fuel or lunch?
Not me, not when I'm driving a car...
"Formation" motorcycle riding on a public roadway in a is an antiquated, sociopathic pack behavour. It is no longer tolerated on public roads outside of this continent.
Out of curiosity: what the heck is a car driver supposed to do in order to overtake a pack of twenty or so morons on a "group ride"? Drive patiently behind them until they choose to stop for fuel or lunch?
Not me, not when I'm driving a car...
Lol. The way my friends ride there Harley’s there are club guys they run tight formation. 85 to 90 mph ... bursts up to 120... nobody is passing them. ...this whole post was written by a retired motorcycle cop, he is a competitive cone rider. I threw it out here to stir the pot. I’m a California rider ride defensive aggressive. Split lanes.
Posts: 477
Threads: 34
Likes Received: 5 in 2 posts
Likes Given: 0
Joined: Feb 2018
(08-27-2018, 01:37 PM)dsan1964_imp Wrote: (08-20-2018, 04:43 AM)rotor_imp Wrote: (08-19-2018, 12:17 AM)dsan1964_imp Wrote: HOW TO UNDERSTAND A BIKER
When you see us moving past you quickly:
Don’t take offense or think we’re trying to "show off”.
Ninety five percent of the time,
we’re trying to get out of your blind spot or taking ourselves out of a potential dangerous situation that has evolved around us. Distancing ourselves from you does not mean we want to race, but that we’re giving ourselves the edge we need at the moment.
When you hear our horn:
Don’t take offense or think we’re trying to aggravate you. All we’re doing is letting you
know where we are in relation to you on the road, and we’re more than likely aware of your inattentiveness to us while you're talking/texting on a cell phone, eating, reading or involved in some other distracting aspect to your driving. It’s important to us, and you, that you know we’re there.
When you hear our loud pipes:
Don’t become angry and hostile toward us. Yes, some are quite loud, but for some, there’s a purpose behind being loud. It’s about letting you know we’re close by and we’re constantly hoping that our investment in this accessory will help save our lives. Our pipes are really not about our ego…it’s a pride and personalization to our form of transportation.
When you see us in our clothes:
Don’t become fearful of us or think us weird. Our leather jackets, chaps, gloves and
boots are the barriers between loosing massive amounts of flesh should something cause us to go down…nothing more, nothing less. Safety gear is paramount to our riding.
When you see aggressive riding bikers:
Don’t put us all in the same stereotypical category as those whose behavior and actions would cause you to react in disgust and intolerance. Many of us do not agree with this style of riding either, and we know and understand that human nature tends to blend us all together as the “same group”. Most of us don’t want that title…and don’t deserve it.
When you see a group of bikers on the roadways:
Give us the courtesy of sharing the road with you. Please don’t “move in” between several
bikers in formation. This gets us very excited and nervous, especially when it’s done with
no due regard for our safety.
Provide us with your awareness of the fact that we are much more vulnerable than you.
We don’t want to challenge you, for all of us are wise enough to know…we’d lose that battle.
When you are turning left or entering a roadway/highway:
Look, then look again…and then one more time. For we can be easily hidden, and appear to be invisible by such things as a
telephone pole, another vehicle, bright lights or the glare of the sun…or possibly, the beads hanging from your rearview mirror, among numerous other items that are displayed there. If you see us flashing our
lights at you or blowing our horn, we’re only trying to ensure that you will see us before tragedy changes both our lives.
When you are behind us:
Please give us the room we need and don’t tailgate us. If you hit us, we’re going down…
HARD! We don’t want to play games with you, we just want to enjoy the ride and the fresh air, and experience that which many of you have never lived for. If we accelerate
away from you, we're only trying to take ourselves out of a bad situation if you insist on being too close.
Thank You for attempting to understand.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
"Formation" motorcycle riding on a public roadway in a is an antiquated, sociopathic pack behavour. It is no longer tolerated on public roads outside of this continent.
Out of curiosity: what the heck is a car driver supposed to do in order to overtake a pack of twenty or so morons on a "group ride"? Drive patiently behind them until they choose to stop for fuel or lunch?
Not me, not when I'm driving a car...
"Formation" motorcycle riding on a public roadway in a is an antiquated, sociopathic pack behavour. It is no longer tolerated on public roads outside of this continent.
Out of curiosity: what the heck is a car driver supposed to do in order to overtake a pack of twenty or so morons on a "group ride"? Drive patiently behind them until they choose to stop for fuel or lunch?
Not me, not when I'm driving a car...
Lol. The way my friends ride there Harley’s there are club guys they run tight formation. 85 to 90 mph ... bursts up to 120... nobody is passing them. ...this whole post was written by a retired motorcycle cop, he is a competitive cone rider. I threw it out here to stir the pot. I’m a California rider ride defensive aggressive. Split lanes.
"Formation" motorcycle riding on a public roadway in a is an antiquated, sociopathic pack behavour. It is no longer tolerated on public roads outside of this continent.
Out of curiosity: what the heck is a car driver supposed to do in order to overtake a pack of twenty or so morons on a "group ride"? Drive patiently behind them until they choose to stop for fuel or lunch?
Not me, not when I'm driving a car...
Lol. I threw it out here to stir the pot. I’m a California rider ride defensive aggressive. Split lanes.
Well, that you did. What do you mean by "defensive aggressive"? I get "defensive" and "aggressive", but not necessarily together.
|
