Oil Change Time!

[Jambo_imp]

Interesting reading Jambo but why do you use car oil and not motorcycle oil : is it just the cost or do you believe they are all the same , changing it often does not change the difference between the two types of oil . Just asking in earnest .

It is a fair question to ask Houtman. For those who do not wish to read my dissertation, then YES, and YES.

I think the most important feature of the (any) oil is the fact that it is full synthetic. It is well known that full synthetic oils perform better in terms of wear, reduced drag, provide very modest improvements in mpg, and out last regular dino juices in terms of breakdown over temperature. I might argue whether one vendor's formula is superior to another. Lots have. I would probably buy the generic Walmart Supertech full synthetic if you could get a flavor without the resource conserving. It is probably Mobil-1 that Walmart is sworn by contract to never divulge. I don't think the Waltons own any refineries.

Perhaps there are additives that really do make a difference for a motor that can rev (not ours) to 14K rpm, and that also bathes the clutch plates. What those additives are, I don't know, and the manufacturers aren't going to say what their secret, proprietary sauces are. I would love to do a 100K mile scientific based comparison of two identical bikes, one with full synth car oil, and another with full synth motorcycle oil, followed by complete motor breakdown and SCEM imaging (electron microscope). I would be willing to bet there would be no discernible differences. Pure speculation.

You could make a great argument at my very conservative oil change intervals, that just putting in the generic Supertech regular oil at $2.50/q is probably all you really need. Spending $4/q on Mobil-1 probably does not really make a difference unless you keep your bike until it has 2-300K miles on it. (I knew a guy who DID that, putting over 200K on his CBR1000RR in TWO years! As you can imagine, all he ever did was RIDE!). For me, I just FEEL like I am treating my bike better using full synthetic, and the cost delta is only about $6 difference from regular dino to synth. All else (filters) is a given and not an equation factor. BUT, the cost delta is 150% from full synthetic car oil (which they sell 1000 times more of) compared to bike oils. Full synthetic car oil is $4/q and bikes $10/q. If you compare to regular dino oil, the cost delta is $400%.

To me, and some will say and I would not argue the point, my position (like a lot when it comes to the oil threads) is based on pure opinion with no supporting empirical evidence in terms of car vs. bike oils. I think that motorcyclists are a very loyal and devoted bunch. I think that oil manufacturers know this and can extract more from us due to our (sometimes emotional) devotion. I am of the opinion that it is likely more marketing than science. Since I change the oil so often, it is inconceivable to me that the higher revs of my Honda CB1100 are breaking down the full synthetic oil very much compared to my Honda Civic, and when you couple it with replacing it with fresh in such a short 3K mile interval, there is no noticeable breakdown difference between the two (CB1100 vs Civic).

When I change the oil, it looks slightly browner than when it goes in, suggesting there was some temperature-based degradation and post-combustion contaminants (like acid), but it is so minor, I find myself wondering if I should reuse it elsewhere like the lawnmower.

For both my beloved Honda bikes and Honda cars, I just go ahead and suffer the 1 hour expenditure of my time and $20 for the bike, and $30 for the car and put in fresh synthetic every 3K miles. I do this knowing full well it is total overkill. I don't think I would do this if I had to suffer through the hassle factor of having someone else do it for me and pay for that, mostly due to the time required to drop it off and pick it up (along with another required vehicle/driver). Since I do it myself, it takes me less time in comparison. The cost of me doing it vs. paying someone is about the same, except me doing it means I can use full synthetic for the cost of regular oil. When I say this, I am comparing the cost of car oil changes. My guess is I am saving a lot compared to bike oil changes, and getting synth, but don't know as I never pay someone to change the oil in my bike.

BTW, the Honda Fit takes less motor oil (3.5q with filter change) than the CB1100 does. I can buy a six pack of Mobil-1 (M1-110A) filters that rank very well in the destructive inspection comparos, for $66 and $11 apiece shipped free. That means it only costs me less than $30 for that car (Fit) and slightly more for the Civic.

What do people here pay at the dealership? I will guess it is $75-100 for an oil change.

For a direct comparison given the SAME oil change 3K mile intervals (using OEM filters), then it would cost me about $990 to use car full synth oil and OEM Honda filters over the course of 100K miles (33 oil changes), vs $1650 for Honda full synth m/c oil and OEM filters doing it myself. That is a $660 difference. Using the PC Racing, maybe the difference would be almost $1K (assuming the filter would last that long...I don't know). You can buy a lot of motorcycling trips, gear, or farkles with the difference.