6th gear....speed vs rpm

[Elipten_imp]

How do we improve it? Pads, disk, or caliper swap?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[the Ferret]

Just saw some good posts by Ptero and Randy and others. I want to continue discussing, but right now I'm going for my morning ride. be back in an hour or so.

[Pterodactyl_imp]

^^^^^. Enjoy the ride. I'm off to bed.

Cheers

[the Ferret]

Great ride! .... As usual

Talking about braking..Randy I believe there is some residual transfer of weight when stopping with the rear brake only (hard to deny physics) but nothing like the transfer of weight on the front end when the front brakes are applied. Which are why larger diameter, multi piston caliper dual discs are on the front, and smaller diameter single disc with fewer piston calipers are on the rear.

Ptero... Yes there is a big difference between " testing" and full emergency panic braking. Not disputing Keith Code's numbers, as I have heard other numbers as well, but whether the numbers are 90/10 80/20 70/30 whatever the numbers are, it is important that the rear brakes function properly. When guys tell me they never use their back brakes, only the front, I just have to wonder why they would give up that extra measure of braking voluntarily. Why would you give up even 10% (using Codes figure) of the braking power the rear brake provides? If rear brakes were not vitally important, why would MotoGP bikes have them? They could save weight and complexity by eliminating a disc, a carrier, a caliper, a hose, a master cylinder and fluid, yet as powerful as the huge front brakes on MotoGP bikes are, they still have rear brakes and I'm guessing when they hurtle down a front straight to a tight hairpin curve, the MotoGP riders use them. Braking hard with the front unloads the weight on the rear making the rear brake less efficient, sometimes to the point of lifting the rear wheel off the ground, but in a non emergency situation ( heck even in an emergency situation) using BOTH brakes is the most efficient way to stop, and both should be strong.

Strong brakes are more important to me than having 100 horsepower, or a motorcycle that will run over 100 mph. I rarely (virtually never) ride that fast, but I often have to brake hard. Several times in the last few days, once when I came around a corner only to find stopped cars in my lane due to a stopped school bus, and another when an old man obviously didn't see me and pulled out in front of me. I rely on my brakes saving my life.

I don't want my rear brake to lock up. I dont want my front brakes to lock up either. A skidding motorcycle is an out of control motorcycle (which is why ABS is such a good safety feature) but I want the strongest front and rear brake I can get prior to them locking up, or prior to the abs kicking in, whichever comes first.

The easiest remedy for brakes that are not as efficient as they should be are multi fold. # 1 bleed the system to eliminate any air in the system. #2 deglaze the brake pads # 3 clean the disc #4 replace the stock pads with a pad with more bite #5 replace rubber lines with stainless lines after that its replace disc, replace caliper, try better brake fluid, depending on how much braking power you desire.

[Elipten_imp]

Stating the obvious, But stopping is ultimately a function of the tire and road surface. If tire has high friction to road more braking force can be applied before it starts skidding. If tire has low friction locking is easy and the skid starts and the same for the road. Just saying it is the road surface, tire characteristics and the brake system.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Short Timer_imp]

I don't have the answer but since my rear brake does not feel spongy or mushy I doubt that bleeding it will help. The pedal is always consistent and steady - just not strong on stopping power until the speed is way down.

I don't feel strongly enough about it to approach the dealer, and applying front AND rear in any panic stop (yep, I've had my share over the years) stops it very well.

[Elipten_imp]

Compared to my 1990 BMW the CB brakes are just amazing in stopping power.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Randy B]

Great ride! .... As usual

Talking about braking..Randy I believe there is some residual transfer of weight when stopping with the rear brake only (hard to deny physics) but nothing like the transfer of weight on the front end when the front brakes are applied. Which are why larger diameter, multi piston caliper dual discs are on the front, and smaller diameter single disc with fewer piston calipers are on the rear.

Ptero... Yes there is a big difference between " testing" and full emergency panic braking. Not disputing Keith Code's numbers, as I have heard other numbers as well, but whether the numbers are 90/10 80/20 70/30 whatever the numbers are, it is important that the rear brakes function properly. When guys tell me they never use their back brakes, only the front, I just have to wonder why they would give up that extra measure of braking voluntarily. Why would you give up even 10% (using Codes figure) of the braking power the rear brake provides? If rear brakes were not vitally important, why would MotoGP bikes have them? They could save weight and complexity by eliminating a disc, a carrier, a caliper, a hose, a master cylinder and fluid, yet as powerful as the huge front brakes on MotoGP bikes are, they still have rear brakes and I'm guessing when they hurtle down a front straight to a tight hairpin curve, the MotoGP riders use them. Braking hard with the front unloads the weight on the rear making the rear brake less efficient, sometimes to the point of lifting the rear wheel off the ground, but in a non emergency situation ( heck even in an emergency situation) using BOTH brakes is the most efficient way to stop, and both should be strong.

Strong brakes are more important to me than having 100 horsepower, or a motorcycle that will run over 100 mph. I rarely (virtually never) ride that fast, but I often have to brake hard. Several times in the last few days, once when I came around a corner only to find stopped cars in my lane due to a stopped school bus, and another when an old man obviously didn't see me and pulled out in front of me. I rely on my brakes saving my life.

I don't want my rear brake to lock up. I dont want my front brakes to lock up either. A skidding motorcycle is an out of control motorcycle (which is why ABS is such a good safety feature) but I want the strongest front and rear brake I can get prior to them locking up, or prior to the abs kicking in, whichever comes first.

The easiest remedy for brakes that are not as efficient as they should be are multi fold. # 1 bleed the system to eliminate any air in the system. #2 deglaze the brake pads # 3 clean the disc #4 replace the stock pads with a pad with more bite #5 replace rubber lines with stainless lines after that its replace disc, replace caliper, try better brake fluid, depending on how much braking power you desire.

This goes to force applied vs momentum. Of course there will be less dive from only using the rear brake because it is not nearly as strong as the front, even if there were only one rotor up front.

BTW I tested my rear brake last night at 1am coming up to a stoplight from about 45 MPH....WOW! I was completely shocked as to HOW WELL it actually hauled me down. I had to stand on it a bit, but if I ever lost my fronts and I needed to limp home a short distance, I would have all the confidence in the world that it would stop me.

I am surprised at how many of you are having fairly large issues with the rear brake judging from my experiences riding and from my wholly unscientific test last night.

[rboe]

In any event; it appears a small number of folks have problems with their rear brakes while most of us seem to have properly working rear brakes which tells me the basic design is fine but that some samples have problems - and should be easily correctable by servicing.

[the Ferret]

Yes, it's very isolated and of little consequence when coming to a stop when using both brakes like you are supposed to. I put 5200 miles on this one without noticing how poor my rear brakes are.lol