The CB1100 Community Forum

Hey, mickey, this is VLJ from motorcycledaily.com.

"The Ferret"? Seriously?



Oh, and your registration page's required question doesn't accept the correct answer. "What are the cubic centimeters of the CB1100?"

I typed in '1,140,' which is the correct answer, and a big red error window popped up that said WRONG! YOU SUCK! YOU DON'T KNOW YOUR MOTORCYCLES AT ALL, DO YOU? YOU'RE A TOTAL LOSER!, or something to that effect.

Sigh. I next typed in '1,100,' and it welcomed me in a warm embrace.

Also, when it asked me to name the person that told me about this place, it rejected 'ferret,' 'mickey,' ''only goes slow,' 'hate's his son's Ducati,' '#ILUVSMESOMELILDANI,' '#26forever,' 'low RPMs rule,' and even 'I always ride below the speed limit.'

At my wit's end, completely out of ideas, I ended up leaving that window blank.

So, anyway...

Against all reason, I've decided that I'm about ready to swap the equally comfortable and much faster, lighter, better braking, better handling, more manageable XSR900 for either this new 2017 CB1100 EX or a Bonneville T120. My XSR has the Dimotiv bar risers, so it sits just as upright as the Honda and Triumph while having more legroom than both. I've never ridden any CB1100 so I don't know how smooth they are, but I assume this Triple is just as smooth as the Honda's large I4, if not quite as vibration-free as the 1200 Bonneville.

And there's the rub, and the reason I'm posting this little missive on this board. I've ridden the T120, so I know how smooth and slow it is, but I've never ridden the Honda, and there are a lot of contradictory reports regarding its smoothness, or lack thereof. While everyone agrees it's very slow, relatively speaking, and certainly less punchy than the T120, never mind the explosive Yamaha, there seems to be quite a range of descriptions regarding the big CB's engine smoothness. Some describe it as utterly smooth; others say it exhibits the usual bit of high-rpm/high-frequency tingles; still others say that Honda's effort at imbuing this model with a bit of rumbly "character" down low results in a mixed bag, with some cool, non-offensive, classic vibes down low, but perhaps too many on top.

You, however, are on record as describing your CB1100 as being smoother than the T120, which I find almost impossible to believe, since the 2017 T120 I just rode had almost literally no vibrations at all, besides the usual twin-cylinder rumble. Otherwise, the mirrors remained glass-smooth at eighty mph, and there was zero numbing vibrations to speak of in the tank, seat, pegs, or grips.

The bike had decent pull, nothing to write home about, and certainly nothing like the XSR, yet it's apparently faster/hits harder than the Honda.

I'm at a complete loss. I don't know what to believe, and I can't bag a ride on a CB1100 to find out for myself. I do know that I find these two motorcycles to be the most attractive bikes currently available, in terms of sheer aesthetics. They're also both supremely comfortable, although the Triumph does have superior legroom. Otherwise, in terms of sitting upright and the lack of forward lean, they seem to be about the same, and also roughly the same as my modded XSR.

Whichever one I'm looking over at any given moment, that's the one I find to be prettier/cooler/more awesome. My opinion flip-flops every hour or so. The minute I think I've got it, that the T120 is hands-down the coolest looking bike on the market, I only have to pour over the exquisite detailing on the Honda and I'm back to square one, totally at a loss as to which I prefer.

They even cost roughly the same: $12,199 for the Honda; $12,300 for the silver/cranberry Triumph, which is the one I'd want. The Triumph already includes factory heated grips, which are a must-have for me, while Honda wants an additional $400 or so to purchase and install their factory grips. Also, the Triumph has a factory electronic cruise control option, which the Honda lacks. On the flipside, almost no one seems to think the Honda's seat needs any help, while Triumph does offer a "comfort seat" option, which sounds rather ominous regarding the stock seat. To be fair, though, most people seem to describe the Honda and Triumph seats as equally comfortable, which is to say, very comfortable.

In the end, both bikes will end up costing roughly the same. The Triumph has a two-year warranty vs one year for the Honda, and a longer valve-inspection interval, but we all know the score regarding the need for such inspections, particularly with the Honda, and we also know the Honda will almost certainly not malfunction during its first two years, so it's pretty much a wash there, as well.

I've owned countless I4s, and only one parallel Twin, and that was an old GS500, which barely counts. Preference-wise, I love...V4s. So, no help there, either.

I do know that I love the sound and feel of the Triumph motor. Sure, it's slow, but I'm trying to convince myself that the Honda and Triumph are fast enough, and that I really ought to start slowing down anyway.

So, what's the truth here? How much does the Honda really buzz? There is no way I will ride the thing at 3500 rpm all the time, the way you do. Just can't do it. I'll want more zip than that. Once I'm up in the 5-6K RPM range, how buzzy is it?

For reference's sake, I've also owned an ST100 and ST1300, and a 2005 GSX-R1000 and 1992 FJ1200, in terms of larger V4s and I4s.

Also, handling? The magazines say that the Honda turns and handles more easily, although it has less ground clearance. It drags the feelers sooner. Kind of strange, that. Superior handling, yet they don't allow you to use it?

Seems like a bit of a wasted opportunity, no?

Bottom line, I'm here to be educated by those of you who have ridden the CB1100 and, hopefully, maybe even the T120 too.

Any and all info, opinions, perspectives, and advice are strongly encouraged.

like I wouldn't recognize the handle VLJ. (VLJ and I have had some great conversations over on MCDaily with regards to motorcycles and MotoGP.. He's from California so he views things differently, which makes it interesting)

hi buddy and welcome to the forum.

We make getting here tough to keep the riff raff out. Apparently it's not tough enough.

Little missive? Lol let me see if I can help. Both the T120 and CB 1100 are fine motorcycles. I own one and my younger brother owns the other...in Cranberry and silver no less. I have ridden his and it is indeed a vast improvement over the 790 T-100 I had. Power is similar on both with a slight edge to the Honda, but when my equally slow brother and I ride together we find ourselves at the same speed, in the same gear and at the same rpms. The bikes power characteristics are very much the same in real life practice.

When I ride his, I feel every throb in the vertical twin. I thought my 790 was smoother in that regard. In comparison I find the CB virtually silky smooth. Some are sensitive to the I 4 vibe. Some tell me they feel the vibes between 4k and 5k and then the bike smooths out again. Since I ride between 2500 and 3500 rpms I truthfully never feel them. 4k on this bike is over 80 mph. I don't ride that fast very often.

Honestly as far as handling I have never ridden the Bonnie that hard, and although I'm a Dani fan, I ride like a slower version of last years Jorge, run it deep, pick my line, roll it over maintaining speed and roll the throttle on to pull out of the corner. Don't need a lot of rpms for that kind of riding.Imo this bike handles very well, holds a line well. I ran my stock Dunlops all the way to their edges. I put on the next size up Michelin 3 and cannot run them to the edge.

Considering conversations we have had in the past, I would find it hard to believe either bike would make you happy considering your need for speed, or maybe more accurately acceleration. Consider the Triumph Speed Triple, or wait and see what the new Kaw 900 retro is like.

Btw Why get rid of the XSR? Like you said light weight, lotsa ponies, you just jonesing for something new? I've ridden a couple XSRs and they are my favorite iteration of that Yamaha triple powerplant.

oh and the Ferret moniker was given to me about 30 years ago by a dear bow hunting friend that recently passed, because he said I was small and fast and usually got what I was going after. The name has just kinda stuck, even though I'm now old and slow and don't chase much anymore.

Mine and my brother's bikes



Oh and I liked that you called the CB Megan Fox over on MCD lol

VLJ says:
September 7, 2017 at 9:16 am
From what I’m seeing so far, it may look relatively “right” (except that it has a radiator) but it sure isn’t very pretty. Compared to the Megan Fox that is the CB1100 or the Adriana Lima Bonneville T120, this thing is Mindy Cohn from “Facts of Life.”
Man I keep thinking about more stuff.

Heated grips are nice no doubt. Kudos to Triumph for including them.

Modes..my brothers has 2. He uses 1. He says he doesn't need a computer to tell him to slow down in the rain.

Clocks.. The CB's clock is better. For some inane reason Triumph made their clock a military clock..you know, 1100, 1200, 1300 ( 1 pm) 1400 (2 pm) no way to make it a regular clock.

Riding the CB only up to 3.500revs is something I often do due to speed limitations and my mood for easy going and relaxtion. The CB is very good at it and it's one of the real strenghs the bike is build for. But in only doing so you shortcut the whole character of the machine only down to one point. The machine offers a very different face together with increasing revs, which is nice, entertaining and lively in its own way. One should not leave this out from time to time, because the CB with its 90HP is also build for to run through the whole spectrum of revs. I think, up from the midrange the CB will have a stronger power than the Bonneville, not having ridden the Triumph.

To me it sounds like a decision between two different motor concepts regardless assumed similar power. If I would have to make a decision between an In Line 4 and a Parallel Twin, I don't have to, I own both, maybe I would choose the 2cylinder. Why? It's enough. But don't get me wrong I like my Honda, a 5 gear 2013 model, which I prefer over the later ones. Besides personal preferences I always would buy a motorbike from a manufacturer I trust more in. Simply written in this case I trust Honda more than Triumph. But buy both.....variatio delectat. And keep the triple.

Wisedrum

Simple answer: I can't afford to keep the Yamaha and add another bike, either in terms of the required space or the cost. Believe me, if I had mickey's money I'd grab an R1200RT, a new Street Triple RS, the CB1100, and the T120. From there, I'd choose a winner between the CB and T120 and sell the loser, leaving me with a big touring bike, a dedicated canyon ripper, and a beautiful retro for daily riding.

I wouldn't get a Speed Triple, in large part for the same reason I swapped my 2014 Street Triple R for the XSR; namely, the seating position. My reconstructed neck won't allow me to do any sort of lean-over at all, not even the Street Triple's or XSR's minimal forward lean.

Thus, the bar risers on the Yamaha. I tried them on the Street Triple and didn't like them. On the Yamaha I don't mind them, except that they slow me down on the freeway by five-to-seven mph.

As for the new Kawasaki retro 900 based on the Z900? If it ends up looking like the first pictures we're seeing, no thanks. There isn't a single piece on that design that I enjoy. Whereas the Honda and Triumph embody the enduring beauty of classic retro design, this new Kawasaki is a prime example of why we (thankfully) moved past the dumpy '70s look.

Speaking of which, now that mickey mentioned it, I think I would change the CB1100 from Megan Fox to Monica Bellucci, since the CB is less of a booty shorts and washboard-abs girl and more of a beautiful, classy, voluptuous, worldly woman. Since the T120 is British, retro, and still crazy-beautiful, I suppose she'd be, hmmm...Elizabeth Hurley?

Works for me.

While watching the Kenny Wayne Shephard concert tonight, I couldn't help but continue to think about those two bikes, and I kept coming up with the things I'd change about them. I was trying to determine whether either bike had more things I dislike, or things I dislike to a greater degree?

This is what I've come up with so far....

CB1100

-Twenty-five more rwhp and ten more ft. lbs of torque. Honda could have easily built this motor to those specs without sacrificing one iota of low-end grunt or easy rideability, and if they had, I would have bought one years ago.

-No speed limiter in the ECU. I don't want to have to re-flash my brand new motorcycle to get the thing to run the way Honda intended. Limiting the top end to 108 mph and fifth and sixth gears to some absurdly low RPM is just anathema to the whole concept of a big-bore Honda I4 that harkens back to various class-leading CBs of yore. It's borderline communist!

-Ditch the 50/50 black/silver engine treatment. Either go all silver, like mickey's 2014 Deluxe, or take that section of blacked-out fins and extend it all the way up to the chrome cam covers. One or the other, please. Pick one. It's a motor, not a bowl of Neapolitan ice cream, or a yin/yang logo.

-Include the factory heated grips as standard.

-For gawd's sake, gimme back the vintage-correct green gauges of mickey's 2014 Deluxe! Why on earth did Honda ditch those?

-Bump that 4.4-gallon tank capacity up to a full five gallons, minimum. The bike already weighs as much as a Rose Parade float, so what's a few more pounds on a bike that's comfortable enough to encourage two hundred and fifty miles per sitting?

I think that's about it. I know mickey would also ask for shaft drive and hydraulic lifters, and I wouldn't turn my nose up at either of those either, but I'm fine with the chain drive and traditional shim-under-bucket arrangement. It's a Honda. Those valves will rarely if ever require adjusting.

As for the T120?

-Forty more rwhp. With both of these bikes I'm shooting for 110 rwhp, which is basically the same as the new Boxer 1200 motor. There's no reason a 1200 cc, liquid-cooled parallel Twin or an 1,140 cc, air-cooled I4 shouldn't make as much power as an opposed Twin of the same basic capacity.

-Since Triumph offers cruise control as an option for this model, just include it as standard. It's already a $12K motorcycle, so why nickel-and-dime us that way?

-Ditch the cheap-looking tank seams. The original Bonnevilles didn't have them, the new Honda doesn't have them, the competing BMWs don't have them, and they represent the one easily fixable aesthetic flaw on what is otherwise a near-perfect retro design. They aren't so bad on the solid black model, but on the silver/cranberry version they stick out like a sore thumb.

-Build it in Old Blighty. Thailand-built is fine for some models, but not for the freaking Bonneville, the marquee model, the brand's most revered name. UK-built vs Thai-built isn't a matter of superior/inferior build quality, not at all. No difference there. It's simply a feel-good thing, and with the flagship Bonneville that crap definitely matters.

-Right-angle valve stems, like the Street Triples. Those things are so nice. Come to think of it, the Honda needs them, too.

-Bump that fuel tank capacity from 3.8 gallons to five gallons.

-Include a helmet lock and bungee hooks, like the Honda.

-Illuminate the front turn signals, like the Honda. It's a funny thing, because I replaced the "Great Pumpkins" on the XSR with smaller, clear, non-illuminated, Euro-spec Yamaha turn signals, but on these two retro bikes I prefer the Honda's illuminated signals.

-Much larger-font numbers on the instruments, please. The numbers and icons are just too small. The Honda dash appears to be much easier to read at a quick glance.

-Solid metal fenders, like the Honda.

I keep adding "like the Honda" a lot here, don't I? Well, yeah. The Honda is just so finely detailed and well built. There are precious few finish details Honda missed or skimped on with this gem of a motorcycle. While both bikes are built extremely well, the pride of ownership factor has to be sky-high with the CB1100.

Yep...still torn.

Yep it's a real dilema we got here. Sorry to hear about your neck VLJ, did not know that. Shame when ailments get in the way of enjoying our favorite hobbies. ( for me it's stubby leg syndrome lol)

Unfortunately wishing one has this and the other has that ignores the fact that neither does. They are what they are, and no amount of hoping is going to change your wish lists into reality, so it comes down to the decision of which one has the shortest wish list. Some members have gotten their CB's up into the 95 hp range, and you can drop a tooth on the front sprocket to give it a bit more urgency, but there are no mods that will get you another 15 horses above that. Honda is not going to include heated grips when they can coerce people into ponying up the extra $ for them. Not Honda's style. Honda gives you what they think you need, and very little else. Think no reverse on the F6B lol.

Nothing anyone can do to get a Bonnie another 40 hp. Good night that's a 50% increase over stock lol. You can make it louder though so it SOUNDS like it has more horsepower. (You can do that for the Honda as well). And you can't see the Bonnies tank seam when you are riding. Honestly I don't notice them and had to walk out and look at mine to see if it had one when the subject first came out on MCD. I seem to remember the original Bonnies having a tank seam right down the middle top of the gas tank covered by a chrome strip? I think my brother gets about 175 miles out of a tank of gas before he needs to refill. I go a little over 200, but if ridden how you ride, I would knock 30 miles off both those figures.

You are right about the valve layout, my ST will have 97,000 miles on it and has never need a shim, my CB 36,000 miles and none needed so far. My CB is still on the original chain and sprockets as well. Not quite shaft drive reliability, but certainly better than in the old days.

How about a Ducati Multistrada? Upright seating, lotsa hp, crisp handling, italian styling, lotsa money, questionable reliability, expensive maintenance. I hear they are all the rage.
Just a thought... What part of Cali are you in. We have a ton of forum members in Cali, perhaps you can meet up with one of them and they will let you ride their CB while they try out your XSR.

Hey Cali guys, can anyone help VLJ out?

(09-08-2017, 06:28 PM)VLJ_imp Wrote: [ -> ]Simple answer: I can't afford to keep the Yamaha and add another bike, either in terms of the required space or the cost. Believe me, if I had mickey's money I'd grab an R1200RT, a new Street Triple RS, the CB1100, and the T120. From there, I'd choose a winner between the CB and T120 and sell the loser, leaving me with a big touring bike, a dedicated canyon ripper, and a beautiful retro for daily riding.

I wouldn't get a Speed Triple, in large part for the same reason I swapped my 2014 Street Triple R for the XSR; namely, the seating position. My reconstructed neck won't allow me to do any sort of lean-over at all, not even the Street Triple's or XSR's minimal forward lean.

Thus, the bar risers on the Yamaha. I tried them on the Street Triple and didn't like them. On the Yamaha I don't mind them, except that they slow me down on the freeway by five-to-seven mph.

As for the new Kawasaki retro 900 based on the Z900? If it ends up looking like the first pictures we're seeing, no thanks. There isn't a single piece on that design that I enjoy. Whereas the Honda and Triumph embody the enduring beauty of classic retro design, this new Kawasaki is a prime example of why we (thankfully) moved past the dumpy '70s look.

Speaking of which, now that mickey mentioned it, I think I would change the CB1100 from Megan Fox to Monica Bellucci, since the CB is less of a booty shorts and washboard-abs girl and more of a beautiful, classy, voluptuous, worldly woman. Since the T120 is British, retro, and still crazy-beautiful, I suppose she'd be, hmmm...Elizabeth Hurley?

Works for me.

While watching the Kenny Wayne Shephard concert tonight, I couldn't help but continue to think about those two bikes, and I kept coming up with the things I'd change about them. I was trying to determine whether either bike had more things I dislike, or things I dislike to a greater degree?

This is what I've come up with so far....

CB1100

-Twenty-five more rwhp and ten more ft. lbs of torque. Honda could have easily built this motor to those specs without sacrificing one iota of low-end grunt or easy rideability, and if they had, I would have bought one years ago.

-No speed limiter in the ECU. I don't want to have to re-flash my brand new motorcycle to get the thing to run the way Honda intended. Limiting the top end to 108 mph and fifth and sixth gears to some absurdly low RPM is just anathema to the whole concept of a big-bore Honda I4 that harkens back to various class-leading CBs of yore. It's borderline communist!

-Ditch the 50/50 black/silver engine treatment. Either go all silver, like mickey's 2014 Deluxe, or take that section of blacked-out fins and extend it all the way up to the chrome cam covers. One or the other, please. Pick one. It's a motor, not a bowl of Neapolitan ice cream, or a yin/yang logo.

-Include the factory heated grips as standard.

-For gawd's sake, gimme back the vintage-correct green gauges of mickey's 2014 Deluxe! Why on earth did Honda ditch those?

-Bump that 4.4-gallon tank capacity up to a full five gallons, minimum. The bike already weighs as much as a Rose Parade float, so what's a few more pounds on a bike that's comfortable enough to encourage two hundred and fifty miles per sitting?

I think that's about it. I know mickey would also ask for shaft drive and hydraulic lifters, and I wouldn't turn my nose up at either of those either, but I'm fine with the chain drive and traditional shim-under-bucket arrangement. It's a Honda. Those valves will rarely if ever require adjusting.

As for the T120?

-Forty more rwhp. With both of these bikes I'm shooting for 110 rwhp, which is basically the same as the new Boxer 1200 motor. There's no reason a 1200 cc, liquid-cooled parallel Twin or an 1,140 cc, air-cooled I4 shouldn't make as much power as an opposed Twin of the same basic capacity.

-Since Triumph offers cruise control as an option for this model, just include it as standard. It's already a $12K motorcycle, so why nickel-and-dime us that way?

-Ditch the cheap-looking tank seams. The original Bonnevilles didn't have them, the new Honda doesn't have them, the competing BMWs don't have them, and they represent the one easily fixable aesthetic flaw on what is otherwise a near-perfect retro design. They aren't so bad on the solid black model, but on the silver/cranberry version they stick out like a sore thumb.

-Build it in Old Blighty. Thailand-built is fine for some models, but not for the freaking Bonneville, the marquee model, the brand's most revered name. UK-built vs Thai-built isn't a matter of superior/inferior build quality, not at all. No difference there. It's simply a feel-good thing, and with the flagship Bonneville that crap definitely matters.

-Right-angle valve stems, like the Street Triples. Those things are so nice. Come to think of it, the Honda needs them, too.

-Bump that fuel tank capacity from 3.8 gallons to five gallons.

-Include a helmet lock and bungee hooks, like the Honda.

-Illuminate the front turn signals, like the Honda. It's a funny thing, because I replaced the "Great Pumpkins" on the XSR with smaller, clear, non-illuminated, Euro-spec Yamaha turn signals, but on these two retro bikes I prefer the Honda's illuminated signals.

-Much larger-font numbers on the instruments, please. The numbers and icons are just too small. The Honda dash appears to be much easier to read at a quick glance.

-Solid metal fenders, like the Honda.

I keep adding "like the Honda" a lot here, don't I? Well, yeah. The Honda is just so finely detailed and well built. There are precious few finish details Honda missed or skimped on with this gem of a motorcycle. While both bikes are built extremely well, the pride of ownership factor has to be sky-high with the CB1100.

Yep...still torn.

Yep

VLJ, the CB1100 is a lovely bike but, if you really have a need for speed, it may leave you feeling wanting.

I never noticed *any* vibration or buzzing on my CB1100 at any speed. Maybe I'm just not sensitive enough. I immediately noticed vibration as soon as I started up the T120 for my test ride, but not once underway. The main advantage the T120 has over the CB1100 is that if you have an inseam of 30 inches or more -- and the more over the more this is true -- is it is going to be more comfortable for your legs.

mickey, while I'm sure the Multistrada is a perfectly good bike, Ducati finickiness notwithstanding, I can't stand its looks, it's too tall, and way too expensive. If I was willing to go that spendy I'd look at the R1200RT or R1200R, or maybe even a Tuono with a set of bar risers.

I have also been considering the Ninja 1000, but its overall look and feel is not really what I'm after, plus the insurance premium is anywhere from twice as high all the way up to ten times higher than the XSR/CB1100/T120, depending on the carrier.

Nah. $12k is about as much as I'm willing to go this time, with do-able insurance, and I'm really drawn to these two naked retro models.

Oh, and I live in northern California, in a small town just east of Sacramento.
A poster named Uletanna sent me a Private Message, but when I tried to respond I discovered that he's not accepting PMs, so I'll post my response here and hope he sees it...

"After reading your message and all three thread-links you provided, I'm surprised you didn't go for the bike I'm actually thinking of swapping out for one of these heavy, slow retros, the XSR900. It's everything you described: very light, very fast, very agile, decent stock suspension, upright riding position, no plastic, unlimited ground clearance, semi-retro looks. With a set of Galfer steel-braided brake lines and EBC HH pads, my XSR brakes as well as my sportbikes. In fact, on most public roads, it's the measure of any sportbike.

I can't do track days any longer, but I'm sure it would do relatively well in that environment also, excepting the limitations of any upright naked.

The main thing is it's even lighter than the Kawasaki 650, with more legroom and superior handling, and nearly twice as much power. Plus it's a Triple, so it sounds and feels uniquely cool, in addition to having a powerband that's every bit as linear as the big CB1100's, only much longer and wider.

Not very pricey, either.

Thank you for the info."

Ulve was another California member, that seemingly came from a high performance background, that had a hard time bonding with his CB, then all of a sudden fell in love with it declaring "it's a keeper" then turned around and sold it and bought a Wolf Sym 150 single I think. Never understood that move, but hey we all have our personal desires. It wouldn't surprise me if he was rid of the Wolf and onto a 690 Duke or something by now, or a 600 supersport.