Reactions to the CB1100 elsewhere...

[Capo]

Origin snobbery is counter productive...Capo

Capo unless you are an enthusiast/ historian. I have been collecting reference books and studying them since the 60s. Lineage is just as important to me in motorcycles as lineage is in people. I know weird huh? Lol

Oh, it's very important to me, Ferret. I'm a dedicated Brit Bike enthusiast, and collect all sorts of historical / reference material on Triumph, Norton, Velo and the like. My point is that it shouldn't be a point of snobbery versus other marques/ origins.

[Guth_imp]

Origin snobbery is counter productive...Capo

Capo unless you are an enthusiast/ historian. I have been collecting reference books and studying them since the 60s. Lineage is just as important to me in motorcycles as lineage is in people. I know weird huh? Lol

Oh, it's very important to me, Ferret. I'm a dedicated Brit Bike enthusiast, and collect all sorts of historical / reference material on Triumph, Norton, Velo and the like. My point is that it shouldn't be a point of snobbery versus other marques/ origins.

I was seriously considering the purchase of a Triumph before the CB1100 came along. In the end, it's the bikes that matter most. The lack of lineage doesn't bother me as much as the attempt to imply that it exists when it doesn't. Snob or not, that's just how I feel.

[cbdtran_imp]

I would have bought the V7 if the CB had not come out. But the V7 is a bit small for me (think long arms and legs) and 50 horses is OK, but ten more would have been better to help on the mountain passes. 80hp is more than enough for me.

V7 is pretty afar, it is a bit crude up close, not as nice as my VF500F 20 yrs ago. I guess they still home cook spaghetti the same way in the factory. That make my comparison unfair. Yes, I would consider the V7 seriously until CB comes out, that eliminate many bikes I have in mind.

I now get used to 80 horses, and long for more, as I discover I love power to pass a bunch of trucks with 15L turbo diesel engines on 6% grade quickly at 80 as effortless as accelerates at 6% downhill all in 5th gear

I would have bought the V7 if the CB had not come out. But the V7 is a bit small for me (think long arms and legs) and 50 horses is OK, but ten more would have been better to help on the mountain passes. 80hp is more than enough for me.

Yes, right, the V7 engine is quite nice and would have been enough for me. Good sound and nice torque.
But the gear box was terrible (okay, if you are used to a Honda gear box then it is hard for other brands to compete with), the V7 has no ABS and ... errr ... it is "Made in Italy" (with all its pros and cons). My colleague has a Guzzi Stelvio and had/has lots of trouble with it.
The Bonnie disappointed me with its boring engine and the too-much-retro look, but a pro was the built quality.
While I was a bit clueless what to do, Honda issued some weeks later the CB 1100.

I am astounded to hear these things on many bikes, a company send out a bad product to buyers has no respect to its customers

[bubblerboy64_imp]

Fellows I own a Bonnie, an America and a Thunderbird in addition to others and of course the CB1100.

This is a bit like discussing flavors of ice cream.

From the point of view of an owner I can't say that I see much if ANY difference in quality Honda to Triumph. Of course that could change given time and use.

The Thunderbird is one powerful smooth and impressive bike. I like to say that it out Harley's the Harley's to which I think it is most comparable. Better smoother engine other wise pretty similar to my Harley Fatboy.

The Bonnie SE is my favorite bike. It's smaller and a little easier handling then the CB but I could see how a larger person would prefer the Honda but performance to me at least is a pretty academic discussion.

The America is just a nice all around cruiser bike and should not be overlooked.

As to preference to brands? I'd rank Honda and Triumph equal pretty much across the board. Quality of build, form and function. Harley is in the hunt. My only "complaint" with Harley is their motors are not as smooth or as powerful as their competition but I am CONVINCED that most Harley owners prefer what I object to regarding their engine designs.

We owners of other brands tend to speculate that Harley owners some how just aren't informed as well as "us" and that they buy Harleys for reasons of prestige or image. I think that's a simplistic view. We are all influenced by image to a greater or lesser degree. Harley is making very nice motorcycles. Very nice.

I believe people buy what they like and obviously I like them all pretty much and I find positive aspects to each of my bikes. The Bonnie is the "best" for me and the one I would pick if I could only pick one. Having said that if a bunch of guys came to my garage and test road all of them my suspicion is that the best bike pick would be pretty much what the market place shows. Lots and lots are going to pick the Harley and the Honda. Having said that each and everyone of the perspective riders when stepping off the various Triumphs is going to say "nice bike". (The CB as well.) They may not drop their own money on one but in my collection there are no bad ones. Nice place to be. I do have to thin the herd next year and I'm going to have to make some difficult choices.

I have not owned a MotoGuzzi it's about the only one I have not. Ducati another one.

[ingobohn_imp]

A buddy in Slovenia had a Moto Guzzi Nevada, had some issues with the bike but his biggest problem was the local dealer. Replaced the Nevada with a HD XR1200 and loves it. Local buddy has a 2009 Griso and sunk a ton of money into it to get it to run the way he wants. I have the 2012 and it runs like a champ. I have three "complaints", too much power, mileage is not that good and the seat sucks. Working on two of them but I fear the mileage thing is just a nature of the beast.

Guzzi seems to have more of what is fun about Italian bikes and less of the bad. I hope the trend continues. The CB embodies all the good about the old Honda and less of the bad (ownership of a CB350F is teaching me four carbs is not a good thing). Now if Honda will just get off its' bum and decide how to fix my bike I'll be golden.

I did find the Bonny to be a very nice machine but the motor had the personality of milk toast. Meh.

According to the grapevine, the quality seems to get better since Piaggio (the Vespa manufacturer) acquired Guzzi some years ago. The V7 2013 model was the first one where Piaggio had a significant influence already during the development phase of the engine (it is said that roughly 70% of the engine parts are "new").
Let's see if this trend fosters - especially with the brand new models like the California 1200 and so on.

I would have bought the V7 if the CB had not come out. But the V7 is a bit small for me (think long arms and legs) and 50 horses is OK, but ten more would have been better to help on the mountain passes. 80hp is more than enough for me.

V7 is pretty afar, it is a bit crude up close, not as nice as my VF500F 20 yrs ago. I guess they still home cook spaghetti the same way in the factory. That make my comparison unfair. Yes, I would consider the V7 seriously until CB comes out, that eliminate many bikes I have in mind.

I now get used to 80 horses, and long for more, as I discover I love power to pass a bunch of trucks with 15L turbo diesel engines on 6% grade quickly at 80 as effortless as accelerates at 6% downhill all in 5th gear

I would have bought the V7 if the CB had not come out. But the V7 is a bit small for me (think long arms and legs) and 50 horses is OK, but ten more would have been better to help on the mountain passes. 80hp is more than enough for me.

Yes, right, the V7 engine is quite nice and would have been enough for me. Good sound and nice torque.
But the gear box was terrible (okay, if you are used to a Honda gear box then it is hard for other brands to compete with), the V7 has no ABS and ... errr ... it is "Made in Italy" (with all its pros and cons). My colleague has a Guzzi Stelvio and had/has lots of trouble with it.
The Bonnie disappointed me with its boring engine and the too-much-retro look, but a pro was the built quality.
While I was a bit clueless what to do, Honda issued some weeks later the CB 1100.

I am astounded to hear these things on many bikes, a company send out a bad product to buyers has no respect to its customers

Maybe it is not (only) a matter of respect but also a matter of the customer's view or focus. For example, if someone does not care about ABS (or even hates it), the V7 or Bonnie would be - maybe - a perfect bike for him.
My colleague test rode the Bonnie after I test rode the bike and although I told him that I am not so enthusiastic about that bike. Later, he told me that he ordered 2 (!) of them, another one for his girl-friend because the Bonnie was the perfect fit for him. As far as I know him I can understand that, he simply has a different focus than I have.
So it is fine that "the market" offers a lot of products for everyone's gusto.

[the Ferret]

Flavors of Ice Cream indeed....

In our family, between my dad, my mother, my two brothers, my sister and I, we have owned Hondas, Yamahas, Suzukis, Kawasakis, Harleys, Indians, Triumphs, BSA's, Moto Guzzis, Sears, Aermachhis, KTMs, and Ducatis ..... literally a couple hundred motorcycles.

Some have been not so good, some have been good, some have been very good, some have been great. Of the motorcycles we have had, Hondas have always been of the highest quality.been that way with my Honda cars as well. All of the Japanese brands have been superipr to all of the other brands. Just no issues with them to speak of. My late model triumph was also a great motorcycle. Regardless we have enjoyed them all.

Like Peter Egan's said in his book Leanings.." I have never had a Honda not get me home, and that says a lot"

[Guth_imp]

Keep in mind that I'm in no way implying that the lack of lineage has anything to do with the quality of the bikes. I understand that the overall quality of Triumph motorcycles rates very high these days. Like I said, I almost bought one myself.

Having worked in marketing for a number of years probably leaves me a bit jaded and the pseudo-lineage, especially when parroted by others does tend to get under my skin.

[Guth_imp]

True enough. But given that scenario, which admittedly is veering further off topic, this equates more to claiming to be an American when you're not.

[rboe]

So, anyone ready for an oil thread now?

[ingobohn_imp]

No, tire thread before - please!!!