Ethanol vs. Your Engine

[Wisedrum]

I live in a very rural area and have access to non-ethanol fuel as it is preferred for the many small engine applications on farm equipment. Question, I know the manual says 86 octane but I have been running the 93 high test anyway, non ethanol at 87 octane should not be a problem, right?

All things equal should have about the same energy as the 93?

Southwend, the CB has low compression, and is low revving. Honda specifies 87 octane, and approved for up to 10% ethanol. You don't need 93 octane and as much as people want to believe and even though wives tales to the contrary abound, your bike will not run any better on 93 octane than 87 octane. You can certainly run 93 if you wish, but you are just wasting money. It will probably run a little better and get better mileage on non ethanol gas from research I have done, but I can't verify that personally. I probably get some of the best mileage on the forum and all I run is 87 octane gas with 10% ethanol. Honda says that is ok for my bike, they are the designers and engineers who built the bike. I take them at their word, I am not an engineer.

some easy and interesting reading if you are so inclined

http://www.cartalk.com/content/premium-vs-regular-1

I stick to this comment. The last couple of months I always used 87 octane gas with 10% ethanol without any problems.
The Honda runs good with an excellent mileage, which my also be due to the warm weather conditions the CB has been driven in.
And the engineers should know more about the bike than any other, which pretend to know a little more, well, but they don't.

Wisedrum

[AndyHe_imp]

Oh I agree it runs fine with 87 octane and 10% ethanol. Runs like a sewing machine.
I just happen to believe that I have seen much better than a 10% MPG improvement when running without ethanol so I don't see it adding value.
The fact that it breaks down over time is also a PITA for mowers and such when they don't get used much.

[emptysea]

Doing some very quick math: i have 17000 miles on my bike over 3 years. Let's say I get 45 mpg. 17000/45=378 gallons used. If I increased my fuel economy by 10%, I would be getting about 50mpg. 17000/50=340 gallons used. A savings of 38 gallons of gas. Let's say that the cost of that gas is $3.00/gallon (I usually pay a bit less than this). That's $114.00 over 3 years or $38.00/year....or a little more than 6/10ths of a cent per mile. I'm just not going to worry about fuel economy in general or how ethanol does or does not affect it specifically.

[Southwend]

Thanks for the info, Ferret. I usually keep multiple 5 gallon containers full of treated non-ethanol gas because my small engines like it and it is much more stable to store than ethanol. I agree that 93 octane is a psychological benefit and no doubt wasteful. Of course the bike was brand new and it made me feel better BUT I think i am over it now. My Wife's Bonnie on the other hand craves the good go juice. I would prefer to keep the Honda filled with 87 stabilized gas anyway. So good info all around. Oh and I like the comment about the 'easy' read, does it have pictures too? How did you know that I was a teacher on summer break, I try not to read anything more challenging than the funny pages until the fall

[the Ferret]

I think my Bonnie called for mid grade 89. Anyhow some links look like links to legal briefs or Kevin Cameron articles. My eyes usually glaze over about 100 words in and I lose comprehension focus with those type articles hence the " easy read" link lol

[ChipBeck_imp]

Gentlemen,

There is one reason to use premium in bikes that don't require it. All Chevron gasolines have Techron additive. It works better than the oxygenates in Shell, Mobil, 76, etc. to keep valves carbon free and fuel injectors clean. Premium Chevron has twice as much Techron per gallon as regular Chevron fuels. My CB does not get ridden that often so I use Premium. Non Top Tier gasoline from Oil Companies like Giant and Maverik and most grocery store stations don't have any detergents and problems with carbon buildup are significant within 10,000 miles. Cheers.

Chip

[redbirds_imp]

Our local grocery store fuel island has the lowest price in town but has no detergent additives. You can select a detergent additive when you turn on the pump but the price per gallon goes up to the price of the name brand gas.

[ChipBeck_imp]

Our local grocery store fuel island has the lowest price in town but has no detergent additives. You can select a detergent additive when you turn on the pump but the price per gallon goes up to the price of the name brand gas.

Using and selling raw gasoline without additives is perfectly legal of course but it's false economy. All major car makers recommend using Top Tier fuels. Without effective detergents hard carbon deposits start building up on intake and exhaust valves which impede air flow, decrease mileage, and increase emissions. Fuel injectors often stop flowing properly as well. For the last 35 years all automakers building cars in the U.S. have used Chevron fuels exclusively for their 50,000 mile emissions and fuel mileage testing. There are no Chevron stations in Michigan so makers there truck Chevron gas nearly 1000 miles to us it. That should tell drivers a lot.

Chip

[JustPassinThru_imp]

Our local grocery store fuel island has the lowest price in town but has no detergent additives. You can select a detergent additive when you turn on the pump but the price per gallon goes up to the price of the name brand gas.

Using and selling raw gasoline without additives is perfectly legal of course but it's false economy. All major car makers recommend using Top Tier fuels. Without effective detergents hard carbon deposits start building up on intake and exhaust valves which impede air flow, decrease mileage, and increase emissions. Fuel injectors often stop flowing properly as well. For the last 35 years all automakers building cars in the U.S. have used Chevron fuels exclusively for their 50,000 mile emissions and fuel mileage testing. There are no Chevron stations in Michigan so makers there truck Chevron gas nearly 1000 miles to us it. That should tell drivers a lot.

Chip

Using and selling raw gasoline without additives is perfectly legal of course but it's false economy. All major car makers recommend using Top Tier fuels. Without effective detergents hard carbon deposits start building up on intake and exhaust valves which impede air flow, decrease mileage, and increase emissions. Fuel injectors often stop flowing properly as well. For the last 35 years all automakers building cars in the U.S. have used Chevron fuels exclusively for their 50,000 mile emissions and fuel mileage testing. There are no Chevron stations in Michigan so makers there truck Chevron gas nearly 1000 miles to us it. That should tell drivers a lot.

Chip
Holiday convenience stores in Michigan make a big deal of selling Top Tier branded gasoline. I always thought it was a Holiday trademark; now I see it used at other stations. Must be a tradmark for a mix of detergent additives - Kwik Trip stores in Wisconsin used the same trademark.

There's a lot of cross-pollination of gas brands - In Ohio, Standard of Ohio country, Sohio/BP took their brands off their tank trucks, because so often they'd be filling up the BP station at one point, and then the Gastown station across the street.

If you buy from a reputable vendor (not reservation gas; not Joe's Gas and Tax Service) you'll probably be okay. The only thing I look for, is, first - non-ethanol when I can get it; and second: If it IS advertised as non-ethanol, MAKE SURE IT DOESN'T SHARE A HOSE WITH OTHER GRADES OF GAS. Separate nozzle for the ethanol free.

[DaSwami_imp]

Our local grocery store fuel island has the lowest price in town but has no detergent additives. You can select a detergent additive when you turn on the pump but the price per gallon goes up to the price of the name brand gas.

Using and selling raw gasoline without additives is perfectly legal of course but it's false economy. All major car makers recommend using Top Tier fuels. Without effective detergents hard carbon deposits start building up on intake and exhaust valves which impede air flow, decrease mileage, and increase emissions. Fuel injectors often stop flowing properly as well. For the last 35 years all automakers building cars in the U.S. have used Chevron fuels exclusively for their 50,000 mile emissions and fuel mileage testing. There are no Chevron stations in Michigan so makers there truck Chevron gas nearly 1000 miles to us it. That should tell drivers a lot.

Chip

Using and selling raw gasoline without additives is perfectly legal of course but it's false economy. All major car makers recommend using Top Tier fuels. Without effective detergents hard carbon deposits start building up on intake and exhaust valves which impede air flow, decrease mileage, and increase emissions. Fuel injectors often stop flowing properly as well. For the last 35 years all automakers building cars in the U.S. have used Chevron fuels exclusively for their 50,000 mile emissions and fuel mileage testing. There are no Chevron stations in Michigan so makers there truck Chevron gas nearly 1000 miles to us it. That should tell drivers a lot.

Chip
Holiday convenience stores in Michigan make a big deal of selling Top Tier branded gasoline. I always thought it was a Holiday trademark; now I see it used at other stations. Must be a tradmark for a mix of detergent additives - Kwik Trip stores in Wisconsin used the same trademark.

There's a lot of cross-pollination of gas brands - In Ohio, Standard of Ohio country, Sohio/BP took their brands off their tank trucks, because so often they'd be filling up the BP station at one point, and then the Gastown station across the street.

If you buy from a reputable vendor (not reservation gas; not Joe's Gas and Tax Service) you'll probably be okay. The only thing I look for, is, first - non-ethanol when I can get it; and second: If it IS advertised as non-ethanol, MAKE SURE IT DOESN'T SHARE A HOSE WITH OTHER GRADES OF GAS. Separate nozzle for the ethanol free.

Now dang, I did not think of that. All my local stations use the same hose. For just filling up a couple of gallons, I can see how that is a big deal, and actually would explain a lot!!!!