CB1100 Featured on Race Tech Website

[spacetiger_imp]

aschem,

If you are referring to the turns (increase or decrease) on the emulator, I would say no change to the 6 turns using the blue springs. Your heavier weight are only relevant to the fork springs.

What have you done with the springs. And, you have to tell us your weight. I am 195 - 200 without riding gear, so what I do for my suspension needds may not match what you need. How about starting a setting up a suspension thread and I'll join you and we'll stumble forward.

Jerry

[kevbroce_imp]

i just emailed Racetech about this setup. They aren't too far from my home, i'm hoping i can get them to install and tune my bike.

[aschem_imp]

i just emailed Racetech about this setup. They aren't too far from my home, i'm hoping i can get them to install and tune my bike.

Let us know how it goes.
[quote='spacetiger' pid='118928' dateline='1452731995']
aschem,

If you are referring to the turns (increase or decrease) on the emulator, I would say no change to the 6 turns using the blue springs. Your heavier weight are only relevant to the fork springs.

What have you done with the springs. And, you have to tell us your weight. I am 195 - 200 without riding gear, so what I do for my suspension needds may not match what you need. How about starting a setting up a suspension thread and I'll join you and we'll stumble forward.

Jerry
[/quote

I'm 215-220 no gear and ride the back roads of E. Idaho

[Paulb_imp]

If I may direct you guys to my thread 'Maxton Suspension'. I've had new cartridges in the front forks which allow preload and rebound adjustment. The system mentioned in this thread only mentions compression damping. As I understand it compression damping and preload basically do the same thing whereas rebound damping controls the rate of return of the spring. Maxton also replaced the rear shocks which now allows infinite preload control and also rebound damping. What I really liked about the Maxton setup was the fact that they put your bike on a rolling road/dyno and load it to simulate the riders weight and then set the preload and damping rates to that weight. I've not had the weather to test the system yet but I'll write a report as soon as I get the chance. With regard to the stock system on the CB1100 I would say that it is adequate for the way the bike is designed to be ridden but only having four rear shock preload settings to deal with everything from a light weight female solo rider to two big males and a load of luggage is asking a lot from just four settings. I also wrote a thread 'weird suspension' describing the odd nature of the 2014 fork spring set up - two different lengths of springs. Maxton saying it does work in an odd sort of way but it is not something you would ever find on a performance bike.

[kevbroce_imp]

[quote="kevbroce_imp" pid="114951" dateline="1452718500"]
i just emailed Racetech about this setup. They aren't too far from my home, i'm hoping i can get them to install and tune my bike.

Let us know how it goes.

aschem,

If you are referring to the turns (increase or decrease) on the emulator, I would say no change to the 6 turns using the blue springs. Your heavier weight are only relevant to the fork springs.

What have you done with the springs. And, you have to tell us your weight. I am 195 - 200 without riding gear, so what I do for my suspension needds may not match what you need. How about starting a setting up a suspension thread and I'll join you and we'll stumble forward.

Jerry
[/quote

I'm 215-220 no gear and ride the back roads of E. Idaho

Let us know how it goes.

Here's what the sent. A bit more than I'd hope to spend but it's awfully tempting!

See Below.

Christie Gunter <Christie@racetech.com>

Thank you Kevin, okay so for the front if you want us to do the install this is what you are looking at paying:



Labor- $125.00

R&R- $75.00 (if you bring in the whole bike)

FEGV S4101- $169.99 emulator vale

FRSP S3534xxx- $129.99 Fork springs

USF05 QT- $30.00 Oil



Assuming that the bike is pretty new you wont need your seals changed however they will inspect when they get them and determine that, if they do need to change them you are looking at an additional $40-50 for the seals at the most.



Now for the rear shocks, you are looking at $799.99 for a set of shocks that are IFP no adjust, meaning that the only adjustment is pre-load adjustment. You can also go for a adjustable shock that is $949.99, this will have IFP w/ rebound and ride-height adjust. I would recommend that you go with the second option, you can also do a IFP shock with Rebound adjust for $899.99. These shocks are completely custom, and will be built to suit you.



If you would like to order the shocks will take about 3-4 weeks to build if you want to send me your shipping info I can get you in the system and get the shocks going and then when they are completed if you want to bring the bike in we can install the shocks for $75.00, and then do the front, if you want to send the forks in you can do that I would ay send them in about a week and half after we start the shocks and then we can ship everything back to you together.

[spacetiger_imp]

[quote="kevbroce_imp" pid="114951" dateline="1452718500"]
i just emailed Racetech about this setup. They aren't too far from my home, i'm hoping i can get them to install and tune my bike.

Let us know how it goes.

aschem,

If you are referring to the turns (increase or decrease) on the emulator, I would say no change to the 6 turns using the blue springs. Your heavier weight are only relevant to the fork springs.

What have you done with the springs. And, you have to tell us your weight. I am 195 - 200 without riding gear, so what I do for my suspension needds may not match what you need. How about starting a setting up a suspension thread and I'll join you and we'll stumble forward.

Jerry
[/quote

I'm 215-220 no gear and ride the back roads of E. Idaho

Let us know how it goes.

Here's what the sent. A bit more than I'd hope to spend but it's awfully tempting!

See Below.

Christie Gunter <Christie@racetech.com>

Thank you Kevin, okay so for the front if you want us to do the install this is what you are looking at paying:



Labor- $125.00

R&R- $75.00 (if you bring in the whole bike)

FEGV S4101- $169.99 emulator vale

FRSP S3534xxx- $129.99 Fork springs

USF05 QT- $30.00 Oil



Assuming that the bike is pretty new you wont need your seals changed however they will inspect when they get them and determine that, if they do need to change them you are looking at an additional $40-50 for the seals at the most.



Now for the rear shocks, you are looking at $799.99 for a set of shocks that are IFP no adjust, meaning that the only adjustment is pre-load adjustment. You can also go for a adjustable shock that is $949.99, this will have IFP w/ rebound and ride-height adjust. I would recommend that you go with the second option, you can also do a IFP shock with Rebound adjust for $899.99. These shocks are completely custom, and will be built to suit you.



If you would like to order the shocks will take about 3-4 weeks to build if you want to send me your shipping info I can get you in the system and get the shocks going and then when they are completed if you want to bring the bike in we can install the shocks for $75.00, and then do the front, if you want to send the forks in you can do that I would ay send them in about a week and half after we start the shocks and then we can ship everything back to you together.

Let us know how it goes.

Here's what the sent. A bit more than I'd hope to spend but it's awfully tempting!

See Below.

Christie Gunter <Christie@racetech.com>

Thank you Kevin, okay so for the front if you want us to do the install this is what you are looking at paying:



Labor- $125.00

R&R- $75.00 (if you bring in the whole bike)

FEGV S4101- $169.99 emulator vale

FRSP S3534xxx- $129.99 Fork springs

USF05 QT- $30.00 Oil



Assuming that the bike is pretty new you wont need your seals changed however they will inspect when they get them and determine that, if they do need to change them you are looking at an additional $40-50 for the seals at the most.



Now for the rear shocks, you are looking at $799.99 for a set of shocks that are IFP no adjust, meaning that the only adjustment is pre-load adjustment. You can also go for a adjustable shock that is $949.99, this will have IFP w/ rebound and ride-height adjust. I would recommend that you go with the second option, you can also do a IFP shock with Rebound adjust for $899.99. These shocks are completely custom, and will be built to suit you.



If you would like to order the shocks will take about 3-4 weeks to build if you want to send me your shipping info I can get you in the system and get the shocks going and then when they are completed if you want to bring the bike in we can install the shocks for $75.00, and then do the front, if you want to send the forks in you can do that I would ay send them in about a week and half after we start the shocks and then we can ship everything back to you together.
If you are handy with a wrench, I can walk you though what needs to be done. You have to be willing to post some pics so we have a reference point.

Some has to start a new thread: Setting up my suspension, and we'll move to get this done. I'm still waiting for that first brave person. Aschem? You posted your weight, so you should be first.

Jerry

[rmack_imp]

just an opinion on this i have race teck emulators with the yellow spring 3 turns 1 extra hole in the plate (harsh on small bumps without it ) race tech 1.oo springs with 15 weight fork oil bearing in mind you have to drill out the lower rods with gazzi premium rear remote shocks and i will tell you this set up is worth every cent just my opinion cheers

[aschem_imp]

I am a total novice at suspension. I have no plans on on working on suspension in my freezer of a garage; I live in SE Idaho and my garage is cramped and unheated (mid 20s). I haven't seen the ground for over a month due to the weekly snow showers.
I do enjoy reading the posts from people who have much more experience and thankful for the knowledge they bring to the discussion.
I initially posted the Race Tech info for people who are interested in changing their stock suspension. I do plan on getting the fork springs replaced and possibly the emulators. I purchased and installed Ikon shocks for the rear and satisfied with the improvement over the stock shocks.

[nhawk7504_imp]

The stock suspension is too stiff for me but it's more a case of me being too light for the spring rate. There is no way one spring can work for 160-250 pounds. I buy a new shock(s) on most bikes I have as a result. My SUZ TU250 was surprisingly great over the truly horrid New England pavement.

Call me overly sensitive but I think it's an overreach for Race Tech to call the stock suspension "mediocre". Almost all factory bike suspensions could be improved upon but that doesn't justify RT's use of mediocre to describe the CB's suspension to hype and sell their products.

[spacetiger_imp]

just an opinion on this i have race teck emulators with the yellow spring 3 turns 1 extra hole in the plate (harsh on small bumps without it ) race tech 1.oo springs with 15 weight fork oil bearing in mind you have to drill out the lower rods with gazzi premium rear remote shocks and i will tell you this set up is worth every cent just my opinion cheers

rmack, I thought I'd pile on some info since the (~24") snow is coming in DC and everything is at a standstill.

So how do you tune the emulator?

You start by taking apart the emulator and studying how the thing works. The rebound side is straight forward; you change the oil weight; there are no planned tuneable features on the devise. I will say, the rebound oil pathway makes ~four 90 degree turns and the compression oil pathway takes two 90 degree turns. So, for simplification the rebound ratio is 2 to 1.

Then, you start looking at the compression oil path way. There are 3 ways to tune that path; preload screw, number of small oil passage holes in the plunger, and selecting the blue or yellow spring. The question becomes, how do you know what to change and by how much? You can decode the compression pathway by doing a little dimensional analysis. If you look at the area the compression oil flow goes through, you can figure out how high the plunger has to raise so the oil passage areas are equal.

Pic 1: This shows the compression oil flow for my set up. I drilled out the other 2 small holes so I have a total of four 3mm holes and I use the blue spring. I can see the oil comes up through the lower emulator body and has to pass through the plunger + four 3mm holes. So, the oil from through the center hole is equal to the area of the four holes + the cylinder opening created as the plunger moves up.

[url=http://s93.photobucket.com/user/spacetiger81/media/CB1100/2.%20%201%20emulator%20analysis_zpsrbo8llox.jpg.html]

Pic 2. Working through the math I can determine the height the plunger has to raise to make the oil flow pathways equal; Area1 = Area2 + Area3. You can see, with 4 holes, the plunger only has to rise 0.098”, or 0.1”, for the areas to be equal. Note: in my previous posted graphic, I showed a higher plunge rise (~0.138”) because I didn’t mathematically account for the spring preload screw diameter. The number posted here accounts for all flow holes.

[url=http://s93.photobucket.com/user/spacetiger81/media/CB1100/2.%20%202%20emulator%20analysis_zps9etbetwe.jpg.html]

Pic 3: So here is the RT recommended starting point; yellow spring, 2 turns of preload and 2 holes. The yellow line represents that recommended starting point. At the lower left, the 2 screw turns gives you a 4 lb preload starting point. The slope of line is 64 lbs/in. The end point is based on the rise height of the plunger with 2 holes. You can see at that point, the spring is pushing against the oil pressure at about 11.1 lbs. Depending on what you are doing at the moment to the front suspension, the oil pressure may be much greater than 11.1 lbs, but I doubt the plunger will just keep going up, it probably just rises a bit more. So how do you pick the starting emulator point, you can pop it in using RT recommended starting point, go riding and see what you like – or, you can take the advise of other riders if they have dialed in the emulator and report what they liked. But be cautious, not everyone knows whats really going on and not every road condition is the same for all riders. So take that into account.

[url=http://s93.photobucket.com/user/spacetiger81/media/CB1100/2.%20%203%20emulator%20analysis_zpsy4w3btrt.jpg.html]

Pic4: But what if you wanted to tune your devise, how do you know what to adjust and more importantly, buy how much? For example, what happens if I drill more hole to the starting point. What happens to the curve? This pic shows the fewer the holes, the higher the plunger has to rise to get the flow ares to be the same. More holes (with lighter weight oil) gives you better control/ride quality for lots of road irregularities. The lower oil pressure at the top is better for medium+ longer rise and dips in the road/curvy roads. The smother the roads or long sweeping roads will be better with higher pressures.

[url=http://s93.photobucket.com/user/spacetiger81/media/CB1100/2.%20%204%20emulator%20analysis_zpskummzugl.jpg.html]

Pic 5: So how does rmack’s set up compare to the RT recommended starting point? He added another 3mm hole (total of 3), stayed with the yellow spring, and increased the preload by a total of 3 turns. You can see the increased preload turn increased the pressure for plunger initial movement from 4 to 6 lbs. this will keep the nose of the bike from dipping down under braking a bit better. By adding another 3mm hole, he has more ability to let quick oil pulses through to handle more road irregularities than the RT recommended starting point. His 12.7 lb pressure is a bit higher so it is a bit better at handling medium+ to longer sweeping roads.

[url=http://s93.photobucket.com/user/spacetiger81/media/CB1100/2.%20%205%20emulator%20analysis_zpssjzq7tff.jpg.html]

Pic 6: This is my choice of set up; four holes, blue spring, and 7 preload turns on the screw. You can see I have more than doubled the pressure needed to start opening the plunger vs. the RT recommended starting point (8.8 lbs vs. 4 lbs). I ride a bit aggressive in traffic and often use the brakes to stop quickly, to this delayed opening keeps the nose up longer. The see the slope of the blue line is less than the yellow line reflecting the different spring rates (40 lbs/in vs. 64 lbs/in). You will note because of the 4 holes, I have the same top end pressure to make the oil flow area the same (12.7 lbs).

[url=http://s93.photobucket.com/user/spacetiger81/media/CB1100/2.%20%206%20emulator%20analysis_zpsya9aehet.jpg.html]

So now, you have the handy relative tuning curves to guide you in dialing in your emulator for how you ride and your road conditions.

Having lived in in the UK for 3 years, I would say most riders over there would like my set up – use 5 wt (best) or 7.5 wt (max) oil.

rmack, I’m going out on a limb and say I bet you’ll like my set up too, especially if you swap to 5 wt oil.

Jerry