The future of Harley-Davidson

[GoldOxide_imp]

I have never owned a Harley, and unless the association that Harley has with its pirate/outlaw clientele changes dramatically, you will never see me on a Harley. Having said that: this Pan America starts to grow on me and I can see it opening up a new market for HD with Americans who want to buy an American motorcycle but are not into cruisers.

Then again, I can also see why this bike will not do very well, especially outside the USA: why would one buy a Harley when s/he can buy a very similar bike (but tested over many years) from BMW, Ducati, or KTM for the same money? Especially when you will do some touring in areas where HD-mechanics are not so common (i.e. everywhere outside of North America) and especially because this bike is loaded with very fancy and probably finicky electronics.

This engine is very promising and a potential game changer for HD, but it remains to be seen how it will perform in its first generation in the real world.

And lastly: the market for ADV bikes is turning away from 1200cc bikes towards 500-800cc bikes. The Pan America is 10 years late.

There is truth in those words bioman.

Even Africa Twin 1100 owners are excited about rumors of a 800 cc class Africa Twin. Many express they would make the move.

[Houtman_imp]

I agree with Bioman , I do not think that this bike is going to sell well at all . I hope for HD that is does but there are so many other great bikes out there for " off road" .

[Cormanus]

I really like the look of it. Good luck, Harley.

[GoldOxide_imp]

I have never owned a Harley, and unless the association that Harley has with its pirate/outlaw clientele changes dramatically, you will never see me on a Harley. Having said that: this Pan America starts to grow on me and I can see it opening up a new market for HD with Americans who want to buy an American motorcycle but are not into cruisers.

Then again, I can also see why this bike will not do very well, especially outside the USA: why would one buy a Harley when s/he can buy a very similar bike (but tested over many years) from BMW, Ducati, or KTM for the same money? Especially when you will do some touring in areas where HD-mechanics are not so common (i.e. everywhere outside of North America) and especially because this bike is loaded with very fancy and probably finicky electronics.

This engine is very promising and a potential game changer for HD, but it remains to be seen how it will perform in its first generation in the real world.

And lastly: the market for ADV bikes is turning away from 1200cc bikes towards 500-800cc bikes. The Pan America is 10 years late.

There is truth in those words bioman.

Even Africa Twin 1100 owners are excited about rumors of a 800 cc class Africa Twin. Many express they would make the move.

There is truth in those words bioman.

Even Africa Twin 1100 owners are excited about rumors of a 800 cc class Africa Twin. Many express they would make the move.
Follow-up: The rumor of an [url=https://motorallyreview-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/motorallyreview.com/new-2022-honda-crf850l-africa-twin-rumors/?amp_js_v=a6&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQHKAFQArABIA%3D%3D#aoh=16140346868009&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fmotorallyreview.com%2Fnew-2022-honda-crf850l-africa-twin-rumors%2F]Africa Twin 850.

[peterbaron]

GO, you gonna have to have it, exactly like this!!

[GoldOxide_imp]

GO, you gonna have to have it, exactly like this!!

Not me [url=http://cb1100forum.com/forum/member.php?action=profile&uid=3454]PB.

The Africa Twin 850 (rumor) is geared to meet Euro 5 emission standards. I suspect Honda is having a more difficult time meeting that standard with the larger mills.

I like my liter bike. I'll stick with it. Watch everyone else shop and gawk at the new models coming out in 2021 and 2022.

[Tev62]

The upmarket version of the Pan America has automatic ride height lowering when you come to a stop which raises back up when you take off. That will attract a wider range of riders, a great feature.

[GoldOxide_imp]

The upmarket version of the Pan America has automatic ride height lowering when you come to a stop which raises back up when you take off. That will attract a wider range of riders, a great feature.

Agreed. It is unique, but maybe not protected - i.e. others may replicate the feature.

Keep in mind it is another thing to "maintain" if it fails. Nevertheless, HD has to try just like Honda has with many innovative user features over the past 10 years.

[Frulk_imp]

I’ve been vacillating on purchasing an ADV bike for a number of years now. Ever since I sold the KLR. My primary concern is weight followed by enough power to pass. Secondary to that is enough room on the bike to carry about 40 pounds of camping gear, food, etc as I would remote camp at the destinations w/o developed campgrounds . I’d ride it mostly on backroad 2 lane blacktop to well maintained gravel roads to fishing spots in the mountain west.

My first choice would prob be the Moto Guzzi V85TT. It appears to make enough power and is close to the weight I prefer. A plus is supposedly seating position which leads to a low center of gravity. However, that’s a non starter based on the abysmal dealer network in the USA. Shame really as I’m drawn to the bike and price is very reasonable. Plus it seems to be somewhat road biased.

My second choice would be the Afrika Twin. Weight and power are right where I want them but at the time I was shopping more seriously than I currently am they didn’t have the tubeless rims. I know that’s been resolved. Plus the DCT is something I think I could really get into. While Honda does have a solid dealership network Honda USA(at least where I live) has absolutely zero understanding of the concept of customer service and how it plays into a long term relationships with their bottom line. I just will not buy a bike from a dealership that takes the approach of ‘one and done’.

That brings me to the Dirt Glide. Prob heavier than what I want but if center of gravity/ seating is low enough that could mitigate some of my concern about low speed handling on loose road surfaces. At 140/145 HP the power for passing is there in spades. Out the door cost will prob be close to $8-10k above the Guzzi and at that point there needs to be some serious soul searching. No doubt the dealer network will be there with follow through warranty support if needed.

I like the mid sized ADV bikes coming out and agree that the big ADV bike ground has been plowed and exploited by other manufacturers to maybe the max extent. Good observation in a previous comment that Harley may be 10 years late to the party. But, they HAVE arrived and now we’re going to see if they can dance.

I’ve yet to see the Yamaha 700 in the flesh but think it may not fill the bill for what I’m looking for which is a planted feel while doing 80mph through open plains with almost daily strong crosswinds for 200+ miles to my destinations.

Spring is around the corner and I’m itching to put the drama of 2020 behind me. A new ADV bike purchase may be the ticket to assist in that mental endeavor.

[GoldOxide_imp]

In regards to the Honda Africa Twin, Honda recently issued a recall on the Adventure Sport model for a fuel tank issue. It took a lot of market pressure to get them to admit there is an issue. At least now they own the problem and dealerships are executing on the Corporate Honda recall. Most dealerships appear to be engaged and in some cases, above expectation in regards to customer support. The issue affects 2018 to some 2021 Adventure Sport models. Details can be had [url=https://www.africatwinforum.com/threads/2018-2020-africa-twin-adventure-sports-atas-fueling-tank-issues-merged.35737/post-308509]here.