01-23-2023, 12:15 PM
Tommy- lots of factors at play...and I never said Harley.
Smaller vehicles with lower power have less to get moving... but less weight and gearing can only do so much- eventually you need power to push through the wind..and the more leisurely higher gears on most vehicles.
Many cars / bikes 'feel' quick off the line in 1-2 gear but try that same vehicle in 3-4th at 80-90-100 and meh.
Look at the vehicle weight, then hp & tq - but importantly at what RPM, and what the engine revs to.
Remember that gearing is simply toque multiplication so a car/bike that needs to shift at 5-6k looses that advantage over a car/bike that can hold a gear until 7-8-9-10-11k even if the peak hp /tq are the same- pay attention to where the good part of the curve is...
Everything being 'equal' every time you need to shift that another bike doesn't- is loosing power to the ground compared to where you were.
Could make same #'s but if it makes it for 2,000 RPM longer will be the much faster bike if ridden correctly.
But if you are talking an 82hp crank engine VS something like a Triumph Rocket, Yamaha Vmax, Ducati Diavel, BMW K1600, well- they make more than enough power to make up for the gearing.
Revs and gearing are where the magic is on 'slower' vehicles because most don't understand it- and simply changing your shift points can loose a straight line race.
When I used to drag race my cars a lot- there were others with the same car (awd stick shift) that would launch at lower RPM so not to spin- and always run slower times & trap.
They didn't understand that the HP difference when I launched at 6,000 RPM- drop the clutch and let her spin- even if I was not at full traction- whatever % loss of power to the ground as I spun all 4 tires was less than the % power gain I made by having the engine WOT 2,000-3,000 higher- AND when I hooked up a second later- I was higher in the RPM as traction bit and the accel was greater.
Same for people that look at a power curve that drops off gradually and want to shift at peak power... unless it is a cliff- don't do it- you may make less engine power- but your gearing at the 'lower power' higher RPM is often better than your 'more' power in the next gear to the ground.. and the longer you hold each gear- the higher- closer to good hp you are going to be in the next gear.
Smaller vehicles with lower power have less to get moving... but less weight and gearing can only do so much- eventually you need power to push through the wind..and the more leisurely higher gears on most vehicles.
Many cars / bikes 'feel' quick off the line in 1-2 gear but try that same vehicle in 3-4th at 80-90-100 and meh.
Look at the vehicle weight, then hp & tq - but importantly at what RPM, and what the engine revs to.
Remember that gearing is simply toque multiplication so a car/bike that needs to shift at 5-6k looses that advantage over a car/bike that can hold a gear until 7-8-9-10-11k even if the peak hp /tq are the same- pay attention to where the good part of the curve is...
Everything being 'equal' every time you need to shift that another bike doesn't- is loosing power to the ground compared to where you were.
Could make same #'s but if it makes it for 2,000 RPM longer will be the much faster bike if ridden correctly.
But if you are talking an 82hp crank engine VS something like a Triumph Rocket, Yamaha Vmax, Ducati Diavel, BMW K1600, well- they make more than enough power to make up for the gearing.
Revs and gearing are where the magic is on 'slower' vehicles because most don't understand it- and simply changing your shift points can loose a straight line race.
When I used to drag race my cars a lot- there were others with the same car (awd stick shift) that would launch at lower RPM so not to spin- and always run slower times & trap.
They didn't understand that the HP difference when I launched at 6,000 RPM- drop the clutch and let her spin- even if I was not at full traction- whatever % loss of power to the ground as I spun all 4 tires was less than the % power gain I made by having the engine WOT 2,000-3,000 higher- AND when I hooked up a second later- I was higher in the RPM as traction bit and the accel was greater.
Same for people that look at a power curve that drops off gradually and want to shift at peak power... unless it is a cliff- don't do it- you may make less engine power- but your gearing at the 'lower power' higher RPM is often better than your 'more' power in the next gear to the ground.. and the longer you hold each gear- the higher- closer to good hp you are going to be in the next gear.