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+--- Thread: Dutch's High idle thread (/showthread.php?tid=4343)
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Dutch's High idle thread - DutchRutter - 09-25-2022
I wanted to post this up more so to keep track of the issue and my experience with it. I've read through a lot of the other posts and I'm pretty certain this falls into the future IACV replacement side.
The last few days have been getting colder on the trips to work in the morning. At first I chocked it up to normal choke functions of a FI bike. But after my testing today I don't think that is the case.
What would happen:
Upon cold start I would see a strong and steady 1500 rpm, kind of normal. After setting off, and the first few stop signs in the neighborhood, I would see the fully clutched in rpm dip to 1400rpm. Each time I let the clutch out (no forward engagement) I would see them raise to 2000rpm then right before forward engagement could be felt, they would drop down to 1000rpm and the bike would be moving like normal. (probably just normal operation up to this point)
After my 30 minute test loop, speeds around 55-80mph sandwiched in between 30mph neighborhood riding, and the bike was well and warm, I was still seeing the same strong 1500rpm idle when in Neutral and fully clutched in, accompanied with hanging revs (such as the "choke" is still engaged).
I went ahead and did the TPS reset, then restarted the now warm bike. The idle RPM was back at its 1100ish rpm mark. I did take a video of the IACV sound which I'll link here. https://www.youtube.com/shorts/dzKTSILMQPA
Hopefully, this stays resolved, but from what I've read so far. I'm expecting it to return eventually and like I said above, an IACV replacement will be in my no longer warrantied future.
This is on a 2014 CB1100 with 16,66X miles on it. Everything has been maintained up to this point, even just did the spark plugs at 16k.
I'll be sure to keep this updated as it progresses.
I'm really trying to keep my head about this ATM. The CB is my only transportation since my truck's trans is now needing warranty work, and will be getting sold once its fixed again. All in hopes of getting something newer. So please pardon any scatterbrained shenanigans.
RE: Dutch's High idle thread - Nachodaddy - 09-25-2022
Dutch, hold off on replacing that IACV. Some of us have done that at great expense and it didn't solve the problem. I will be replacing my ECU in the near future. Partzilla has the best price on them right now. Mine will be here later in the week and I will report on the results. Those who have had success replacing the ECU had replaced the IACV with the only improvement being they had a lighter wallet.
RE: Dutch's High idle thread - Nachodaddy - 09-25-2022
You may find my thread on re-setting the ECU. Basically, you remove both the positive and negative leads from the batter and connect them together without letting them touch the battery poles. I use a wire with alligator clips on each end. I remove the battery from the bike just to be sure they don't touch the battery poles. Leave the leads connected for about 15 minutes. Take the dog for a walk, drink a cup of coffee or check the new posts on the Forum. Then put everything back together. You might find that the fast idle/unstable idle problem is much improved. This points to the ECU. I had excellent success with this, but I am installing a new ECU to see if that is the answer. It worked for Empty Sea and a couple of others. It should be easier and a little less expensive and more effective than replacing the IACV. We will see.
RE: Dutch's High idle thread - PowerDubs_imp - 09-25-2022
Resetting any ECU - on any vehicle - only resets it's adaptation.
An ECU has a program- and that program adjusts +/- within a certain allowness.
Resetting doesn't change the program- nor it's input
Same ECU- same if now, then this, and same input- regardless of causation = same result after a period of time.
I'm fairly in the mindset that the newer version of ECU software- which could change not only the behavior of the hardware duty cycle- but also the programs scale duration- are the cure to the problem.
Are the 15+= model year showing the same idle issue?
RE: Dutch's High idle thread - DutchRutter - 09-25-2022
Thanks guys! I knew there'd be a good bit of information on this. I was pretty floored to find so many different threads on it. I kinda felt bad about starting yet another one instead of adding onto an existing.
I'll definitely hold off on replacing anything at this point. I have to keep the CB in one piece and running reliably until I can get this truck fixed (hopefully soon as the weather is getting cold and soon to be getting wet) I'm kind of a riding sissy at this point and would like to avoid riding in the rain. After that is sorted, I can afford to take the CB down to complete whatever needs done.
I do think you all are onto something solid. And while I don't know much about electronic tuning it sounds like solid logic that the sensors are working properly but the ECU is sending mixed signals to the other components which are also functioning properly.
Really up to this point the bike hasn't skipped a beat and has been absolutely flawless. Then the weather dropped some and BAM this happens. This mornings ride was probably around 58-60°F btw. And it did it so smoothly I had thought it was just in my head or normal. As if the cooler air cut enough heat out of things to kick the high idle circuit back on. But thats not how things should work, at least in my mind.
At this point I'm hoping I haven't done anything to cause any future problems. If/when the idle kicks back up I'll be sure to post up before doing anything, in case there is some testing I could do to help out. An ECU reset doesent sound too terrible which is a pleasant change. Thank you all for the help with this. I for one greatly appericate it.
RE: Dutch's High idle thread - Cormanus - 09-25-2022
I wonder if there is anyway of determining the firmware version of an ECU? If Nachodaddy’s new ECU is running the same firmware as the one it’s replacing, he should notice no difference.
RE: Dutch's High idle thread - GoldOxide_imp - 09-25-2022
(09-25-2022, 02:03 PM)Cormanus_imp Wrote: I wonder if there is anyway of determining the firmware version of an ECU? If Nachodaddy’s new ECU is running the same firmware as the one it’s replacing, he should notice no difference.
Very likely there is using the Honda (or equivalent) diagnostic and programming utility. One can simply state on the work order to quote the old and new firmware versions as part of the completion. You might need to beat the question into them since routinely they overlook the request or simply ignore it.
RE: Dutch's High idle thread - Nachodaddy - 09-25-2022
As I understand it, my new ECU is different from the old one. The old one had part number 38770-MGC-A23. The new one is 38770-MGC-A24. Let's hope that means there is an improvement.
RE: Dutch's High idle thread - bioman_imp - 09-26-2022
Interesting topic!
Just a side question:
(09-25-2022, 05:52 AM)DutchRutter_imp Wrote: I wanted to post this up more so to keep track of the issue and my experience with it. I've read through a lot of the other posts and I'm pretty certain this falls into the future IACV replacement side.
The last few days have been getting colder on the trips to work in the morning. At first I chocked it up to normal choke functions of a FI bike. But after my testing today I don't think that is the case.
What would happen:
Upon cold start I would see a strong and steady 1500 rpm, kind of normal. After setting off, and the first few stop signs in the neighborhood, I would see the fully clutched in rpm dip to 1400rpm. Each time I let the clutch out (no forward engagement) I would see them raise to 2000rpm then right before forward engagement could be felt, they would drop down to 1000rpm and the bike would be moving like normal. (probably just normal operation up to this point)
After my 30 minute test loop, speeds around 55-80mph sandwiched in between 30mph neighborhood riding, and the bike was well and warm, I was still seeing the same strong 1500rpm idle when in Neutral and fully clutched in, accompanied with hanging revs (such as the "choke" is still engaged).
I went ahead and did the TPS reset, then restarted the now warm bike. The idle RPM was back at its 1100ish rpm mark. I did take a video of the IACV sound which I'll link here. https://www.youtube.com/shorts/dzKTSILMQPA
Hopefully, this stays resolved, but from what I've read so far. I'm expecting it to return eventually and like I said above, an IACV replacement will be in my no longer warrantied future.
This is on a 2014 CB1100 with 16,66X miles on it. Everything has been maintained up to this point, even just did the spark plugs at 16k.
I'll be sure to keep this updated as it progresses.
I'm really trying to keep my head about this ATM. The CB is my only transportation since my truck's trans is now needing warranty work, and will be getting sold once its fixed again. All in hopes of getting something newer. So please pardon any scatterbrained shenanigans.
What did you do to reset the TPS?
RE: Dutch's High idle thread - DutchRutter - 09-26-2022
(09-25-2022, 11:32 PM)Nachodaddy_imp Wrote: As I understand it, my new ECU is different from the old one. The old one had part number 38770-MGC-A23. The new one is 38770-MGC-A24. Let's hope that means there is an improvement.
If it does not I'll happily buy it off you and see if it solves my issue. Really just a shot in the dark at that point. I have no way of knowing what version mine is at except for asking the Honda dealership nicely to tell me.
@Bioman, I found the procedure here on a few of the older threads about this topic. Basically, key on, kill switch set to run, bike not running. Then you very slowly turn the throttle from closed to wide open and back to closed. Do that 2 times then turn the key off. Didn't help once the high idle circuit kicked back on.
*Update on the problem* The ride in this morning, I had high hopes but quickly found the high idle was still with me at every stop. It was probably 58 or so outside. I'll do what NachoDaddy said and complete the ECU reset procedure tonight after work and see how that effects things on tomorrow's commute.