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+--- Thread: Staintune (/showthread.php?tid=8847)
RE: Staintune - PowerDubs_imp - 04-24-2018
This is where it gets confusing if you don't understand what gearing is-
"if the actual available power doesn't change"
Depends on where you measure and define 'available'.
Again- engine power output does not change. Power applied to the rear wheel does.
Oh- and yes I 100% agree with the above suggestion of improving your own skills as that is much much more important. And protective gear. Lots of it.
Before you should ever consider $1,000+ into more power you should have $1,000+ worth of armor when you ride into the battle of today's traffic. If not- the world is your cheese grater.
RE: Staintune - misterprofessionality - 04-24-2018
(04-24-2018, 12:57 AM)The ferret_imp Wrote: No, well maybe. If you are used to riding around in a certain gear at a certain rpm, riding around in 1 or 2 gears lower will make it feel peppier. I usually ride at 2500-3500 rpms in 5th or 6th gear at say 55 mph. If I were to ride around in at the same speed in 3rd gear, the rpms would be more like 4-6000 and it would feel peppier upon acceleration even though the motor is not any stronger actually. Changing gearing (lowering it with bigger rear sprocket or smaller front sprocket) has the same effect.
ahhah. and I'm already running in the 4-6 range most of the time (unless i'm in the middle of nowhere maintaining a steady speed). i do that specifically because my acceleration is measurably better and more responsive in that range. So, in terms i can understand, i'm already kind of doing the thing.
(04-24-2018, 01:03 AM)PowerDubs_imp Wrote: This is where it gets confusing if you don't understand what gearing is-
"if the actual available power doesn't change"
Depends on where you measure and define 'available'.
Again- engine power output does not change. Power applied to the rear wheel does.
Oh- and yes I 100% agree with the above suggestion of improving your own skills as that is much much more important. And protective gear. Lots of it.
Before you should ever consider $1,000+ into more power you should have $1,000+ worth of armor when you ride into the battle of today's traffic. If not- the world is your cheese grater.
yea that's me.
RE: Staintune - the Ferret - 04-24-2018
another thing to consider lowering the gearing to make it feel peppier, will have a detrimental effect on top speed. You will reach rev and speed limiters sooner and your top speed will be lower. Now this is where an ecu reflash would help as with a reflash you can raise the rev limit in each gear by 500 rpm and eliminate the factory top speed limiter.
Plus that process is less than 1/2 the cost of a slip on with a lot more real world benefit.
RE: Staintune - Capo - 04-24-2018
Looks like I'll have a minty Staintune off my '13 to sell. PM me for details.
RE: Staintune - PowerDubs_imp - 04-24-2018
(04-24-2018, 01:25 AM)The ferret_imp Wrote: another thing to consider lowering the gearing to make it feel peppier, will have a detrimental effect on top speed. You will reach rev and speed limiters sooner and your top speed will be lower. Now this is where an ecu reflash would help as with a reflash you can raise the rev limit in each gear by 500 rpm and eliminate the factory top speed limiter.
Plus that process is less than 1/2 the cost of a slip on with a lot more real world benefit.
2 nitpiks (sorry )
Gearing lower IS peppier, not just 'feel'.. I know what you mean, but to someone who doesn't understand gearing and engines this could be another point of confusion.
And on top speed, like most matters 'depends' is the answer.
Taking the limiter out of the equation, most vehicles end up being drag limited as opposed to gear limited.
Meaning they basically run out of enough available power to overcome the wind at speed- and simply can't pull the gearing even if 'on paper' shows a mathematical speed calc.
In such a case, gearing lower can actually increase real world top speed capability but not by huge amounts. The faster you go, the power required increases dramatically. A very small increase in mph can require a relatively large increase in power comparatively.
When you hear people telling stories talking about driving really high speeds- most are either bs, speedo error, etc.
I've been in cars before that will go faster in 5th gear than 6th for example.
RE: Staintune - misterprofessionality - 04-24-2018
Powedubs: just to make sure i'm not misunderstood, all of my concerns about performance come from the point of view of a commuter. top speed is totally irrelevant to me, because you'll never catch me going any faster than 90. I just want it to be as assertive as possible, without overstressing the engine, while getting there.
RE: Staintune - the Ferret - 04-24-2018
Dubs totally agree with all that except for a bike like the CB 1100 which comes with artificially low factory ECU set rev and speed limitations.
if MP is never going to exceed 90 anyway, a lowering of gearing would give him the least expensive and most bang for his bucks. Doubt he could lower the gearing enough to worry about the factory set top speed limiter.
(04-24-2018, 01:35 AM)Capo_imp Wrote: Looks like I'll have a minty Staintune off my '13 to sell. PM me for details.
Hey lower the gearing for under $100 and buy Capos used Staintune and you could have the cats meow for acceleration and sound.
win win
RE: Staintune - SportsterDoc - 04-24-2018
(04-24-2018, 12:44 AM)misterprofessionality_imp Wrote: RGR, so to confirm what i'm hearing here: All the BHP gains i've been reading about/been told about are lies, and the true gain is never any more than about 5 HP in total from fueling/air modification. That does change my plans if true. Understand, it's very misleading when i poke around on the net and read posts from people raving about how much more power and throttle response they get when they do an ECU flash, only find out later that it's really just a piddly increase in performance. I'm glad there's somebody out there willing to tell me how it really goes.
There is very little info on the internet about the CB1100, other than this forum and I am a fairly new member.
RE: Staintune - PowerDubs_imp - 04-24-2018
For actual real world all day fun- a simple sprocket change will make the bike accelerate quicker, in all gears, at all rpm. The RPM cruising on the highway will be a little higher if that matters. I find the '14 6-speed to be fine with that.
I would not change the muffler or pipe looking for power- but a Staintune sounds and looks fantastic. I love mine.
Other than that- save your money towards good riding gear, a riding class or the book 'proficient motorcycling' and suspension if you want to improve the way the bike rides.
RE: Staintune - SportsterDoc - 04-24-2018
Lower gearing will increase acceleration, but will also lower the first gear and successive shift points.
Keeping it under about 8,000 RPM, shift points are about
First: 60 MPH
Second: 80 MPH
Third: 100 MPH
Pulling out onto a highway near one of my hiking areas, with vehicles typically at 80 MPH, I can easily reach merging speed in second gear, in ~/< 6 seconds.
Considering the peak RPM for HP, I see little benefit to raising the rev limit.
See this link for 2013 model and note the HP/torque graph.
https://www.cycleworld.com/2013/07/02/2013-honda-cb1100-road-test-review-photos-specs#page-5
Excerpt:
"What you get instead of a lofty peak is a beautiful, wide plateau of usable power: 56 foot-pounds of torque is immediately available below 2000 rpm, and over 60 ft.-lb. from 3000 rpm to beyond the 82-hp peak at 7200 rpm. Once you’re in top gear and rolling, shifting is mostly optional. A little vibration in the grips and seat maxes out at about 5000 rpm and 90 mph, which is faster than you’ll want to go on this one until you find a windscreen or some lower bars; a limiter cuts in at 110 mph, anyway.
For 2014:
86 HP @ 7500 RPM
65.6 ft lbs @ 5700 RPM