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+--- Thread: Clutch/Brake fluid (/showthread.php?tid=5015)
RE: Clutch/Brake fluid - peterbaron - 02-19-2019
Max and others, thanks for your additional input.
Just thinking loudly about two things:
1* clutch master cylinder push rod, can it be installed in reverse/wrong way, causing binding or limited stroke???, the manual just says: install the push rod to the boot with its direction as shown ( 9-13, 3rd pic from top with side description)
2. If the master cylinder piston>push rod>> does not have proper stroke = the clutch will not do its job properly
2* Let's consider there is nothing wrong with the clutch and its control, would you consider shifter/gear box/mechanism problem, or definitely not ?
>
I think we covered entire clutch control system in inexpensive way.
RE: Clutch/Brake fluid - DBM_imp - 02-19-2019
(02-19-2019, 11:02 AM)peterbaron_imp Wrote: Max and others, thanks for your additional input.
Just thinking loudly about two things:
1* clutch master cylinder push rod, can it be installed in reverse/wrong way, causing binding or limited stroke???, the manual just says: install the push rod to the boot with its direction as shown ( 9-13, 3rd pic from top with side description)
2. If the master cylinder piston>push rod>> does not have proper stroke = the clutch will not do its job properly
2* Let's consider there is nothing wrong with the clutch and its control, would you consider shifter/gear box/mechanism problem, or definitely not ?
>
I think we covered entire clutch control system in inexpensive way.
Thinking outside the box. If any previous oil changes where done with auto oil with anti friction additives, that would foul the clutch plates and cause slippage.
RE: Clutch/Brake fluid - peterbaron - 02-19-2019
(02-19-2019, 04:20 PM)DBM_imp Wrote:(02-19-2019, 11:02 AM)peterbaron_imp Wrote: Max and others, thanks for your additional input.
Just thinking loudly about two things:
1* clutch master cylinder push rod, can it be installed in reverse/wrong way, causing binding or limited stroke???, the manual just says: install the push rod to the boot with its direction as shown ( 9-13, 3rd pic from top with side description)
2. If the master cylinder piston>push rod>> does not have proper stroke = the clutch will not do its job properly
2* Let's consider there is nothing wrong with the clutch and its control, would you consider shifter/gear box/mechanism problem, or definitely not ?
>
I think we covered entire clutch control system in inexpensive way.
Thinking outside the box. If any previous oil changes where done with auto oil with anti friction additives, that would foul the clutch plates and cause slippage.
Thinking outside the box. If any previous oil changes where done with auto oil with anti friction additives, that would foul the clutch plates and cause slippage.
you said to be the original owner with good and proper oil change intervals????...explain that oil sentence please, assuming not recommended oil was used, correct?
P.S home computer went dead yesterday, expect slower response, typing from phone is no pleasure
RE: Clutch/Brake fluid - jimgl3_imp - 02-19-2019
50k miles slow and go as he described it, maybe time for some clutch parts...
RE: Clutch/Brake fluid - GoldOxide_imp - 02-19-2019
(02-19-2019, 04:20 PM)DBM_imp Wrote:(02-19-2019, 11:02 AM)peterbaron_imp Wrote: Max and others, thanks for your additional input.
Just thinking loudly about two things:
1* clutch master cylinder push rod, can it be installed in reverse/wrong way, causing binding or limited stroke???, the manual just says: install the push rod to the boot with its direction as shown ( 9-13, 3rd pic from top with side description)
2. If the master cylinder piston>push rod>> does not have proper stroke = the clutch will not do its job properly
2* Let's consider there is nothing wrong with the clutch and its control, would you consider shifter/gear box/mechanism problem, or definitely not ?
>
I think we covered entire clutch control system in inexpensive way.
Thinking outside the box. If any previous oil changes where done with auto oil with anti friction additives, that would foul the clutch plates and cause slippage.
If that was the situation, then yes DBM. Slippage would be the overall and constant behaviour and be obvious all the time. I believe it starts happening within an hour of riding after the [incorrect] oil change.
If this was the case, I have seen some situations reverse after a proper oil (+ filter) change, again, within an hour duration of riding or less. I have heard others with less success.
Clutch/Brake fluid - mattmcuomo@yahoo.com - 02-20-2019
I have always used Honda oil. Either 10/30 or 10/40. I have always used Honda filters too. I am well versed on maintenance and I am capable of repairs and upgrades. I know how to adjust clutch lever and all that good stuff. This feeling that the clutch is not releasing is just driving me crazy. It functions but it feels like a delayed release when pulling in the clutch while going slow in first gear. Like it takes a second before I can actually “coast” in first gear while rolling. Does that explain anything?
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RE: Clutch/Brake fluid - peterbaron - 02-20-2019
(02-20-2019, 12:31 AM)MMC_imp Wrote: I have always used Honda oil. Either 10/30 or 10/40. I have always used Honda filters too. I am well versed on maintenance and I am capable of repairs and upgrades. I know how to adjust clutch lever and all that good stuff. This feeling that the clutch is not releasing is just driving me crazy. It functions but it feels like a delayed release when pulling in the clutch while going slow in first gear. Like it takes a second before I can actually “coast” in first gear while rolling. Does that explain anything?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
MMC, excellent feedback, which assure us there is no problem witch clutch control section/L-side.
Now the clutch = R-side..you may take a quick look as per Max post #9:
" if you remove the oil filler cap you can see the clutch plates, with a light it is easier to see them move....... pulling the clutch handle in and keep it pulled in for some time, if the plates stay apart for a minute "
at the same time you might? be able to see clutch discs wear and plates discoloration.. if not, next you may have to pull off clutch cover and inspect as per shop manual, if you feel comfortable to do this kind of job?
This is the best advice, I can give now, based on your feedback and tests done so far
Plates should not show excessive discoloration an clutch discs must be within spec thickens as per manual...maybe you will see something else??
We'll be glad to hear back from you..
Clutch/Brake fluid - mattmcuomo@yahoo.com - 02-20-2019
(02-20-2019, 02:43 AM)peterbaron_imp Wrote:(02-20-2019, 12:31 AM)MMC_imp Wrote: I have always used Honda oil. Either 10/30 or 10/40. I have always used Honda filters too. I am well versed on maintenance and I am capable of repairs and upgrades. I know how to adjust clutch lever and all that good stuff. This feeling that the clutch is not releasing is just driving me crazy. It functions but it feels like a delayed release when pulling in the clutch while going slow in first gear. Like it takes a second before I can actually “coast” in first gear while rolling. Does that explain anything?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
MMC, excellent feedback, which assure us there is no problem witch clutch control section/L-side.
Now the clutch = R-side..you may take a quick look as per Max post #9:
" if you remove the oil filler cap you can see the clutch plates, with a light it is easier to see them move....... pulling the clutch handle in and keep it pulled in for some time, if the plates stay apart for a minute "
at the same time you might? be able to see clutch discs wear and plates discoloration.. if not, next you may have to pull off clutch cover and inspect as per shop manual, if you feel comfortable to do this kind of job?
This is the best advice, I can give now, based on your feedback and tests done so far
Plates should not show excessive discoloration an clutch discs must be within spec thickens as per manual...maybe you will see something else??
We'll be glad to hear back from you..
MMC, excellent feedback, which assure us there is no problem witch clutch control section/L-side.
Now the clutch = R-side..you may take a quick look as per Max post #9:
" if you remove the oil filler cap you can see the clutch plates, with a light it is easier to see them move....... pulling the clutch handle in and keep it pulled in for some time, if the plates stay apart for a minute "
at the same time you might? be able to see clutch discs wear and plates discoloration.. if not, next you may have to pull off clutch cover and inspect as per shop manual, if you feel comfortable to do this kind of job?
This is the best advice, I can give now, based on your feedback and tests done so far
Plates should not show excessive discoloration an clutch discs must be within spec thickens as per manual...maybe you will see something else??
We'll be glad to hear back from you..
Yeah. I will check out clutch through filler hole when I can. If I have to I will pull off clutch cover. No problem there, except I didn’t really want to. Lol
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
RE: Clutch/Brake fluid - GoldOxide_imp - 02-20-2019
(02-20-2019, 03:11 AM)MMC_imp Wrote:(02-20-2019, 02:43 AM)peterbaron_imp Wrote:(02-20-2019, 12:31 AM)MMC_imp Wrote: I have always used Honda oil. Either 10/30 or 10/40. I have always used Honda filters too. I am well versed on maintenance and I am capable of repairs and upgrades. I know how to adjust clutch lever and all that good stuff. This feeling that the clutch is not releasing is just driving me crazy. It functions but it feels like a delayed release when pulling in the clutch while going slow in first gear. Like it takes a second before I can actually “coast” in first gear while rolling. Does that explain anything?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
MMC, excellent feedback, which assure us there is no problem witch clutch control section/L-side.
Now the clutch = R-side..you may take a quick look as per Max post #9:
" if you remove the oil filler cap you can see the clutch plates, with a light it is easier to see them move....... pulling the clutch handle in and keep it pulled in for some time, if the plates stay apart for a minute "
at the same time you might? be able to see clutch discs wear and plates discoloration.. if not, next you may have to pull off clutch cover and inspect as per shop manual, if you feel comfortable to do this kind of job?
This is the best advice, I can give now, based on your feedback and tests done so far
Plates should not show excessive discoloration an clutch discs must be within spec thickens as per manual...maybe you will see something else??
We'll be glad to hear back from you..
MMC, excellent feedback, which assure us there is no problem witch clutch control section/L-side.
Now the clutch = R-side..you may take a quick look as per Max post #9:
" if you remove the oil filler cap you can see the clutch plates, with a light it is easier to see them move....... pulling the clutch handle in and keep it pulled in for some time, if the plates stay apart for a minute "
at the same time you might? be able to see clutch discs wear and plates discoloration.. if not, next you may have to pull off clutch cover and inspect as per shop manual, if you feel comfortable to do this kind of job?
This is the best advice, I can give now, based on your feedback and tests done so far
Plates should not show excessive discoloration an clutch discs must be within spec thickens as per manual...maybe you will see something else??
We'll be glad to hear back from you..
Yeah. I will check out clutch through filler hole when I can. If I have to I will pull off clutch cover. No problem there, except I didn’t really want to. Lol
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Understood. It is a drag of inconvenience.
RE: Clutch/Brake fluid - max - 02-20-2019
MMc just as a baseline i tried this test;
Bike with cold engine on center stand, rotate wheel by hand in neutral, put in first gear, pull in the clutch lever and"free up" the initial clutch drag.
After the initial clutch drag is overcome the wheel spins but i can feel increased drag from the clutch basket, by slowly releasing the handle the drag stays the same but increases after the first inch of the tip of the handle moves away from the handlebars and the clutch plates close the gap.
In other words the drag remains constant for the first 30% of the release and gradually increases over the remaining 70% of travel.
Sorry for harping on but i just want to help your situation, best wishes; Max