+- The CB1100 Community Forum (https://cb1100forum.net/forum)
+-- Forum: Honda CB1100 Discussions (https://cb1100forum.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=5)
+--- Forum: Mechanical & Technical (https://cb1100forum.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=7)
+--- Thread: Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 (/showthread.php?tid=5507)
RE: Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 - dsinned_imp - 07-06-2016
In all seriousness, I'd have to say, not having hydraulic valves, makes my short list of design disadvantages.
Honda had them in the smaller displacement inline four Night Hawk, so they already had a working design. I think one of the most often heard criticisms of the CB1100 is its 8k valve adjustment service interval. Because of the major hit on cost of ownership, most other makes are able to at least double this interval even without hydraulic valves. The cost of this routine maintenance can be as much as $1000; that's a huge turnoff in the minds of potential buyers!
RE: Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 - redbirds_imp - 07-06-2016
Valve maintenance interval seems short but I have never owned a bike with shim under bucket design that needed adjustment. Hydraulic lifters would be much preferred and are present on most all OHC autos so I don't understand why Honda does not use this technology on motorcycles, would be a great selling point, even Harley uses them. My Guzzi and BMW had push rods and valve adjustments were easy to perform at home with a set of feeler gauges and a wrench or two but it seems I was always resetting them.
My other gripe is rust. This bike has started rusting on the triple clamps, turn signal bases and the fork tubes. Inexcusable for a bike that stays garaged and has only rarely seen rain. Never had a rust problem to this extent with any other bike I've owned.
RE: Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 - AzBob_imp - 07-06-2016
(07-06-2016, 04:48 AM)redbirds_imp Wrote: Valve maintenance interval seems short but I have never owned a bike with shim under bucket design that needed adjustment. Hydraulic lifters would be much preferred and are present on most all OHC autos so I don't understand why Honda does not use this technology on motorcycles, would be a great selling point, even Harley uses them. My Guzzi and BMW had push rods and valve adjustments were easy to perform at home with a set of feeler gauges and a wrench or two but it seems I was always resetting them.
My other gripe is rust. This bike has started rusting on the triple clamps, turn signal bases and the fork tubes. Inexcusable for a bike that stays garaged and has only rarely seen rain. Never had a rust problem to this extent with any other bike I've owned.
Most autos do not rev past 7k RPM, and the ones that do have very expensive valve trains to combat valve float.
RE: Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 - redbirds_imp - 07-06-2016
True enough but I cannot remember the last time my CB tached much over 5K. I always short shift and let the low end torque work.
RE: Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 - Offroad - 07-06-2016
The biggest short coming I experienced in the twisties recently is the range between 1st and 2nd gear.
Dropping to 2nd from 3rd for a curve was no big deal, but dropping to 1st from 2nd for those up hill hair pins was painful.
I guessed about a 2000 rpm drop between 1st and 2nd but only 1000 rpm between 2nd and 3rd.
I hardly ever use 6th gear, I wish they would have taken 6th and inserted it in between 1st and 2nd.
RE: Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 - flynrider - 07-06-2016
(07-06-2016, 05:32 AM)AzBob_imp Wrote:(07-06-2016, 04:48 AM)redbirds_imp Wrote: Valve maintenance interval seems short but I have never owned a bike with shim under bucket design that needed adjustment. Hydraulic lifters would be much preferred and are present on most all OHC autos so I don't understand why Honda does not use this technology on motorcycles, would be a great selling point, even Harley uses them. My Guzzi and BMW had push rods and valve adjustments were easy to perform at home with a set of feeler gauges and a wrench or two but it seems I was always resetting them.
My other gripe is rust. This bike has started rusting on the triple clamps, turn signal bases and the fork tubes. Inexcusable for a bike that stays garaged and has only rarely seen rain. Never had a rust problem to this extent with any other bike I've owned.
Most autos do not rev past 7k RPM, and the ones that do have very expensive valve trains to combat valve float.
What I don't get is that the Nighthawk and the CB11's I4s have nearly identical redlines. The hydraulic tappets on my Nighthawk work pretty well up to redline. Both engines are tuned more for low-midrange power, rather than high rpm power delivery.
Knowing Honda, they probably had an engineering reason for going with the shim under bucket style. I'd love to know what it was.
RE: Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 - dsinned_imp - 07-06-2016
The cynical reason is to make more money for Honda Dealers, but surely there must have been a technical reason. Although, I can't think of any reason why not. OTOH, I may not log more than 8,000 miles, during the short number of years I have left as an active motorcycle enthusiast due to my advanced age. ;-)
Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 - Cormanus - 07-06-2016
(07-06-2016, 03:32 AM)Inhouse Bob_imp Wrote:(07-06-2016, 03:22 AM)riceburner_imp Wrote:(02-10-2014, 11:32 PM)The Spaceman_imp Wrote: Here's my list of design failings of the CB:
1. It's air-cooled. What were they thinking? It's so much easier to control engine heat, and thus provide more power for comparable displacements, with water-cooling.
2. There's no fairing. Riders are exposed to the elements, including wind-blast, rain, and cold. A large, modern fairing would not only resolve those issues, but would also provide a location to install features such as "Infotainment" systems, GPS, satellite TV, etc.
3. No luggage. Where the heck are you supposed to put your hair dryer if you take a road trip? A large top case and side-bags would go a long way here.
4. Chain drive. Are you kidding me? A shaft drive would be quieter, cleaner, and virtually zero maintenance. CB buyers are stuck with cleaning and lubricating chains for the life of the motorcycle.
5. I-4 engine layout. This engine design is simply outdated. A V-4 or horizontally opposed 6 cylinder engine would produce more power and fewer vibrations.
6. Single headlight. Two headlights would provide better visibility for both the rider and surrounding traffic. Shame on Honda for not investing a few dollars more here.
So Spaceman,sounds like a Gold Wing or GW Valkyrie,or CTX 1300 fits your desires,what you say?? Honda makes bikes for a variety of tastes,needs,wants and desires!!!Well who would have imagines that.
So Spaceman,sounds like a Gold Wing or GW Valkyrie,or CTX 1300 fits your desires,what you say?? Honda makes bikes for a variety of tastes,needs,wants and desires!!!Well who would have imagines that.Methinks he was being just a bit facetious.
So Spaceman,sounds like a Gold Wing or GW Valkyrie,or CTX 1300 fits your desires,what you say?? Honda makes bikes for a variety of tastes,needs,wants and desires!!!Well who would have imagines that.
Methinks he was being just a bit facetious. Facetious? The Spaceman? Never!
RE: Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 - Inhouse Bob - 07-06-2016
(07-06-2016, 04:01 PM)dsinned_imp Wrote: The cynical reason is to make more money for Honda Dealers, but surely there must have been a technical reason. Although, I can't think of any reason why not. OTOH, I may not log more than 8,000 miles, during the short number of years I have left as an active motorcycle enthusiast due to my advanced age. ;-)
Ah heck, dsinned, you could get that in a couple of weeks if you put your mind to it!
RE: Design Disadvantages of the CB1100 - olekzap_imp - 07-07-2016
(07-06-2016, 11:34 AM)offroadfx4_imp Wrote: The biggest short coming I experienced in the twisties recently is the range between 1st and 2nd gear.
Dropping to 2nd from 3rd for a curve was no big deal, but dropping to 1st from 2nd for those up hill hair pins was painful.
I guessed about a 2000 rpm drop between 1st and 2nd but only 1000 rpm between 2nd and 3rd.
I hardly ever use 6th gear, I wish they would have taken 6th and inserted it in between 1st and 2nd.
I actually just noticed this the other day. I feel like you can easily short-shift and not bog down between all the gears except for 1-2. Taking off from a stoplight in 1st in traffic and it feels like you have to decide between revving out 1st unnecessarily or shifting into 2nd early and it just not feeling right.