+- The CB1100 Community Forum (https://cb1100forum.net/forum)
+-- Forum: Honda CB1100 Discussions (https://cb1100forum.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=5)
+--- Forum: Mechanical & Technical (https://cb1100forum.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=7)
+--- Thread: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread (/showthread.php?tid=4317)
RE: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread - Jurlie_imp - 07-30-2019
(07-29-2019, 07:14 PM)max_imp Wrote: Thanks Jurlie, the reason for the old and new shim sizes is simple;I had no idea they are sold as a set. First thing that I've found are individual shims on Partzilla or BikeBandit for $6 a piece. I've ordered and waiting for delivery currently.
1 we get an idea what shim sizes and how many are required and;
2 we learn about valve clearance behavior in our bikes.
As far as i can work it out my cb919 and the cb1100 use the same size shims ( 7.48 mm. ) and also the same shim thickness ( ranging from 1.95 to 2.05 mm ) and we need more than 3 as supplied with the usual kit of the same size.
For a quick overview we created this thread and a spreadsheet for this purpose;
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oqQaAxkDBnJMwaupL8ctle85ThCTLYdyiFWDyKVbJ3I/edit#gid=473671721
as of yet i have only bought shims with 0.05 mm interval but would like to get the in-between 0.025 interval as well for the future.
Out of interest did you un-tension the cam chain when measuring?
(07-29-2019, 07:14 PM)max_imp Wrote: Thanks Jurlie, the reason for the old and new shim sizes is simple;I was following the manual: using special tensioner tool for a hundred bucks I've screwed tensioner clockwise as much as it allowed. Was that un-tensioning?
1 we get an idea what shim sizes and how many are required and;
2 we learn about valve clearance behavior in our bikes.
As far as i can work it out my cb919 and the cb1100 use the same size shims ( 7.48 mm. ) and also the same shim thickness ( ranging from 1.95 to 2.05 mm ) and we need more than 3 as supplied with the usual kit of the same size.
For a quick overview we created this thread and a spreadsheet for this purpose;
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oqQaAxkDBnJMwaupL8ctle85ThCTLYdyiFWDyKVbJ3I/edit#gid=473671721
as of yet i have only bought shims with 0.05 mm interval but would like to get the in-between 0.025 interval as well for the future.
Out of interest did you un-tension the cam chain when measuring?
For moderator:
could you please replace the numbers in my previous comment with following? I've added the shim marking.
Clearance; Old shim size; (Old shim marking); New Shim Size
Cyl 1:
Ex
0.31 2.012 (200) 2.050
0.33 1.976 (198) 2.025
In
0.18 2.027 (202) 2.050
0.19 2.027 (202) 2.075
Cyl 2:
Ex
0.30 1.930 (192) 1.950
0.33 1.928 (192) 1.975
In
0.18 2.029 (202) 2.050
0.20 1.981 (198) 2.025
Cyl 3:
Ex
0.32 1.910 (190) 1.950
0.32 1.908 (190) 1.950
In
0.19 1.979 (198) 2.025
0.19 1.956 (195) 2.000
Cyl 4:
Ex
0.30 1.910 (190) 1.925
0.30 1.915 (190) 1.925
In
0.21 1.956 (195) 2.025
0.21 1.981 (198) 2.050
RE: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread - max - 07-30-2019
Thanks Jurly, you're right on the money, inserting the tool and screwing it in is the right way, also see this thread;
http://cb1100forum.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=8677
For anybody who needs such a tool here is a youtube video with an alternative:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiEomqC-UBI
And here is what i made and just tested on my cb1100;
It is made out of 1 mm. copper sheet because it was easy to cut and is strong enough to do the job, i have previously used it on my cb919 hornet, the bolt next to it is m6 for size reference.
Thanks again for all your work, when i have some time i will enter it into the spreadsheet if that's ok with you.
RE: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread - Cormanus - 07-30-2019
(07-30-2019, 02:18 PM)Jurlie_imp Wrote:(07-29-2019, 07:14 PM)max_imp Wrote: Thanks Jurlie, the reason for the old and new shim sizes is simple;I had no idea they are sold as a set. First thing that I've found are individual shims on Partzilla or BikeBandit for $6 a piece. I've ordered and waiting for delivery currently.
1 we get an idea what shim sizes and how many are required and;
2 we learn about valve clearance behavior in our bikes.
As far as i can work it out my cb919 and the cb1100 use the same size shims ( 7.48 mm. ) and also the same shim thickness ( ranging from 1.95 to 2.05 mm ) and we need more than 3 as supplied with the usual kit of the same size.
For a quick overview we created this thread and a spreadsheet for this purpose;
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oqQaAxkDBnJMwaupL8ctle85ThCTLYdyiFWDyKVbJ3I/edit#gid=473671721
as of yet i have only bought shims with 0.05 mm interval but would like to get the in-between 0.025 interval as well for the future.
Out of interest did you un-tension the cam chain when measuring?
(07-29-2019, 07:14 PM)max_imp Wrote: Thanks Jurlie, the reason for the old and new shim sizes is simple;I was following the manual: using special tensioner tool for a hundred bucks I've screwed tensioner clockwise as much as it allowed. Was that un-tensioning?
1 we get an idea what shim sizes and how many are required and;
2 we learn about valve clearance behavior in our bikes.
As far as i can work it out my cb919 and the cb1100 use the same size shims ( 7.48 mm. ) and also the same shim thickness ( ranging from 1.95 to 2.05 mm ) and we need more than 3 as supplied with the usual kit of the same size.
For a quick overview we created this thread and a spreadsheet for this purpose;
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oqQaAxkDBnJMwaupL8ctle85ThCTLYdyiFWDyKVbJ3I/edit#gid=473671721
as of yet i have only bought shims with 0.05 mm interval but would like to get the in-between 0.025 interval as well for the future.
Out of interest did you un-tension the cam chain when measuring?
For moderator:
could you please replace the numbers in my previous comment with following? I've added the shim marking.
Clearance; Old shim size; (Old shim marking); New Shim Size
Cyl 1:
Ex
0.31 2.012 (200) 2.050
0.33 1.976 (198) 2.025
In
0.18 2.027 (202) 2.050
0.19 2.027 (202) 2.075
Cyl 2:
Ex
0.30 1.930 (192) 1.950
0.33 1.928 (192) 1.975
In
0.18 2.029 (202) 2.050
0.20 1.981 (198) 2.025
Cyl 3:
Ex
0.32 1.910 (190) 1.950
0.32 1.908 (190) 1.950
In
0.19 1.979 (198) 2.025
0.19 1.956 (195) 2.000
Cyl 4:
Ex
0.30 1.910 (190) 1.925
0.30 1.915 (190) 1.925
In
0.21 1.956 (195) 2.025
0.21 1.981 (198) 2.050
Done
RE: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread - max - 07-31-2019
Spreadsheet is now updated, thank you;
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oqQaAxkDBnJMwaupL8ctle85ThCTLYdyiFWDyKVbJ3I/edit#gid=473671721
RE: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread - zirconxi_imp - 07-31-2019
Hi all, I am tommy and i am new here. recently I have just done VC and found the following
Cyl 1:
Ex
0.30, 0.31
In
0.18,0.18
Cyl 2:
Ex
0.30, 0.30
In
0.18, 0.18
Cyl 3:
Ex
0.30, 0.30
In
0.15, 0.15
Cyl 4:
Ex
0.28, 0.30
In
0.15, 0.18
Just wondering if the valve clearance will increase or decrease over time since most of my exhaust valve is on the loose side. Also what's the torque for 4 bolts on the camshaft cap? I have popped a cylinder head cover bolt and have to remove the camshaft cap to machine and remove the broken stud. due to that experience, i just tighten the camshaft cap lightly due to fear of another broken bolt. so are all cylinder head cover bolts, just slightly hand tighten.
RE: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread - Cormanus - 07-31-2019
Welcome aboard zirconxi. Thanks for posting your valve clearance results. How many kms has the bike travelled?
Which model CB1100 do you have and how long have you had it? Maybe head over to the new members section and introduce yourself.
RE: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread - zirconxi_imp - 07-31-2019
(07-31-2019, 07:04 PM)Cormanus_imp Wrote: Welcome aboard zirconxi. Thanks for posting your valve clearance results. How many kms has the bike travelled?
Which model CB1100 do you have and how long have you had it? Maybe head over to the new members section and introduce yourself.
Hi Cormanus, the bike is a 13 model and had travelled 30,000km, I bought it since 3 years ago when she just clocked in at 6500km. Will do a proper introduction once I found the new member section, kind of lost in the forum,
RE: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread - Lord Popgun - 07-31-2019
Welcome Tommy!
Cylinder head cover bolt—7 ft lbs.
RE: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread - max - 07-31-2019
Hi Tommy, welcome to the forum and thank you for posting your vc's.
I don't claim to be a mechanic but i like to know "what makes things tick" and have always done my own maintenance on my vehicles so take my advice with some skepticism and if anyone has a better explanation i would like to hear it so we all can learn something and improve ourselves
The impression i get from reading the spreadsheet is that initially when the engine is new the cams and buckets are not " polished in " , they are ground and have to achieve their high polish over time as the engine runs in and they rotate in their position as can be seen from the markings on the top of the buckets, who are truly worn round, this is done on purpose, all cams are positioned eccentric so the area of "wear" is as big as possible to prolong the life of the engine and to extend the valve adjustments increments.
For this reason it is important that the buckets do not get mixed up and all end up in their respective seats and the shims are placed with the text facing up on top of the valves where they have the biggest mechanical support area and have lubrication applied when re-inserted in their position
These area's are a lot bigger than the original screw adjustable tappets from the old style and retain an oil film much better.
During this time the valves also run in and settle on the seats, they do not rotate and are always under spring tension.
So in the "settling period" anything can happen, the clearance can get bigger or smaller depending on how good the technician at the time installed the valve clearance and if there are deposits that settle on the seat surface and decrease the vc, this is picked up at the first vc check.
The trend is for them to increase the vc so the shims are replaced with bigger sizes ( best are done with 0.025 mm. shim intervals ) but there is the odd one that gets smaller, so it depends.
The valve system is designed to have long vc intervals and slowly increase as the valves wear the seats down over time.
Generally small vc is bad because the valve can fail to close, not cool enough and consequently burn ( melt ) when the engine heats up, but a loose valve is not such a bad thing although it wears faster and is noisier, it still cools enough as the seat transfers the heat from the exhaust gas when it is closed.
RE: The OBSERVED Valve Clearance thread - max - 08-03-2019
Spreadsheet now updated, thanks Tommy.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oqQaAxkDBnJMwaupL8ctle85ThCTLYdyiFWDyKVbJ3I/edit#gid=473671721
.